Trust me - worth the investment, Dave.

In the UK the Dart(Sprint)15 class association started running Pro-Am prizes. First boat paired with last boat, second boat paired with second last boat etc. This idea proved successful and was then adopted by other classes giving an incentive to the novice to improve, and an incentive to the more experienced sailors to coach the paired-up novice and to maintain or improve on their own position.

Cheshirecatman

DUDE, where do you come up with this stuff??? I mean, seriously???

When was the last time you went to a D11 regatta? All the ones I've been to have had GREAT parties. Their B and C fleets are also some of the larger ones around.

No one is saying to change points regattas, but that we need to add other, lower-key, learn to sail (and race) events. These have been extremely popular and successful in various parts of the country (Doug's race clinic in NH in the old days, Hobie 101 in the NW more recently).

Cheshire, I agree totally and I proposed such an event locally here last year (team racing on a pro/am basis). We haven't gotten that off the ground yet.

Mike

I'm beginning to wonder if that insulin hasn't negatively affected your thought processes.

You just have your cape on too tight Jake :P

Cutting off oxygen to your brain.

Alot of Hobie Flet 20 Events are FUNSAIL only events. Once a month we get together and have a day of sailing, pot luck games on the beach, ect. We even do a few up to the damn around the island and finish by that bouy. every month from march till october. come on out.

I liked the non-structure at Catapalooza. I think that was the essence of the event.

Mike, You are such a reactionary.... Look at some facts... not just what you want to believe.

Where do I come up with this???... Div 11 2008 results! published on Hobie Div 11 web site.

B fleet turnouts 5 out of 8 events had 16b fleet races
four of the five events had 4 boats or less! No C fleet

I define that as VERY SMALL since it's less then a 5 boat minimum to make a class in most parts of the world.

Most of them do their one event a year...
data at same place...Three B fleeters did two or more regattas. ... IE one more event then their local home event.

So, most of the recreational racers are doing one local event a year. No C fleet means ... no recreational sailors coming out to give racing a try. Division 11 is one of the largest divisions in the HCA.



Do more? With respect to Division 11 taking on a program of teaching sailing, hobie 101. yada yada yada... In previous years It was talked about each and every meeting and there is unanimous agreement that it would be great... but.. It never flies and this year... the division did not even pretend they were committed to making it happen because no fleet would step up and say they would even try it.

All of which supports my point that you can't take a racing organization that puts on regatta events and have it serve both the racer and the recreational sailor. (A nice party is not going to keep the racers coming back unless they get what they want which is good racing)

Want more evidence that a good party is not enough... note that the Sailing Anarchy FLA regatta which should have a great party has cratered because the racers did not support it ahead of time for whatever reasons. Oh and the recreational racers or recreational sailors are not showing up either!

My point, .. Why attempt to change the focus or image of the racing organization like Div 11? It is better for them to do what they do well then try to invent 1/2 Assed solutions while trying to change their stripes.

The solution to Mysterio's problem is not a mystery... Club racing is the solution, it's great, and it belongs at CLUBS. Cat sailors and most importantly, Cat Racers, need to move the boat out of the back yard.. pick a Yacht club, join en mass and support the club activities.

It sounds like Gulfport is begging/ recruiting/ standing on their head to attract some Hobie sailors to join. I have heard many of the YC's in So Cal are asking the cat sailors to join. In the Chesapeake region, PRSA, Rehboth Bay SA, West River SA and Rock Hall YC are homes to former back yard sailors.

All of the ideas that would get more cat racers or cat sailors going are most easily done at a Yacht Club.

Oh and if if it means fewer weekend regattas so that you can support the club events .. that would be a good tradeoff imo.

Well, I stand by what I wrote.

Division 11 has some of the strongest racing around, and if they are concerned about their numbers, I have no doubt that they know how to fix it.

Regardless of what you've seen, I know that the learn-to-sail and learn-to-race events are HUGELY successful. Fun days are just as important.

I know from personal experience, not checking out results on a website. I for one would never have started racing if it weren't for Doug's race clinic in D12. I was dead-set against racing for many, many years (mostly, I was intimidated). That event hasn't happened in years, and we haven't been able to convert any "fun sailors" since. There's no way you're going to convince me that's just a coincidence.

Mike

Do you refuse to get my point?..

It's not that learn to race... learn to sail etc etc programs don't work...

It's just not what a racing organization wants to do! the people who make up the organization want to support the racers who want to go racing. They want to do mentoring programs for the new racers, junior racing programs. put on nationals or regionals. Hold a racing clinic. Have a rules clinic for the new rules etc etc.

The individuals who want to do learn to sail and learn to race programs are not going to be running the racing program.

Why call for one organization to do the other's mission.... you just loose focus!

Just because I don't agree with you doesn't mean I don't understand what you're saying.

Maybe what you're saying is true for some of the organizations that you have direct/indirect experience with. BUT...

I am telling you that the racing clinics and learn-to-sail events that we've run in D12 were hosted by Hobie fleets, and all the volunteers were... wait for it... ACTIVE RACERS!!! And, not all of them were Hobie sailors, some raced other beach cats.

We knew it was absolutely imperative to keep the thing going. There is no growth in racing if you're only training the same people, you have to keep new blood coming in.

Mike

which is why I mentioned the college sailors. God knows that after sailing on V15's, 420s and JY's they'll be ready for some real sailing.

I think the basic want/need is to get enough boats to an event so everyone can get out of it what they want and to sustain the event financially. Whether or not its all about the trophy or just seeing how many tacks we didn't blow, everyone has there own agenda. The NAC is where all the Type A racers gather, and do their thing anyway.

Something that I see in the threads above is a distinct line in the sand. An either/or condition, black/white.

A deep personal look inside Division 4 (Pacific Northwest)last year showed a full spectrum of sailor types.
We've got Forumula, OD, Adventure, and Portsmith hardcore race only sailors. All the way over to, camp on the beach, I just want to reach all day and drink something in my free hand types.

Our challenge as leaders is to facilitate the organization to at least sustain membership, and to hopefully grow and strengthen. Respecting the differences, and finding a balance is the only way I see to make this work.

Look I don't get involved in these kinds of arguments.. but this statement is FALSE. FALSE FALSE FALSE. wait.. wait.. FALSE.
Not a single person in the region I sail in has ever displayed an attitude so bleak as what you describe. NEVER have I heard a participant, in ANY regatta, whether placing first or last, leave with a bitter attitude towards the event.

It IS, dammit, the party, the sportsmanship, the relationship and friendship built amongst sailors of ALL skill levels at these events that bring people back... and this interconnection, my friend, is NOT built on the water, but rather on dry ground. So please feel free to retract your quoted statement. I do not want to argue with anyone, but if you disagree then by all means have at it; just know that you are wrong!

"We followed the lead of CRAM, CRAB, CRAW, OCRA."

There's your mistake.
You should have been following the lead of CRAP
Catamaran Racing And Partying

Formed many moons ago by myself and Tom Korz in his kitchen.

Speaking of different foods.
Tator Tot Casserole made it to my Superbowl party.
It's better than you would think. I finished the last bowl for breakfast the next morning.

CRAP is the way to go. Partying was fantastic back in days of HUGE A, B and C fleets, arguing with the Prindle and NACRA sailors was most invigorating, but more important was whose crew had a better packed bikini. So there, Ha! (Big Sigh!) I loved all of it.
Closest we can get these days? Spring Fling: Keep it up Mr. Ernie!