| Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Jake]
#193381 10/13/09 07:50 PM 10/13/09 07:50 PM |
Joined: Aug 2001 Posts: 1,307 Asuncion, Paraguay Luiz
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A wing 60% the size of a typical fabric sail rig will apparently generate 10 to 20% more lift...according to some "experts" on Sailing Anarchy. I'm not sure that those numbers aren't a little generous to the wing.
I'm not sure if the numbers are fair, but the Porsmouth yardstick indicates about 5% diference (57.7 against 60.5).
Luiz
| | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Luiz]
#193396 10/14/09 12:53 AM 10/14/09 12:53 AM |
Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,584 +31NL Tony_F18
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Posts: 2,584 +31NL | | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Jake]
#193416 10/14/09 08:52 AM 10/14/09 08:52 AM |
Joined: Oct 2002 Posts: 1,226 Atlanta bvining
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Posts: 1,226 Atlanta | Originally Posted By: sbflyerYes they could, pretty good couple of threads re. wings at SA in the Multihulls, with input from the C class guys who actually sound like they really know what they're talking about, including using wing with spin. They don't when class racing because of sail area restrictions btw...
I wouldn't say "spinnaker" ... more like a big code 0 or screacher. These boats will never have the apparent wind anywhere near 90 degrees.
Chances are you'll probably see a smaller jib/headsail when going upwind and the big screacher unwind for the downhill stuff. Yeah, thats what I meant to say. I cant believe that the AC looks like it is going to be sailed with multi's AND it looks like they are going to use rigid wing sails. If someone had suggested that 4 years ago I would have laughed in their face. Now this is looking like more and more of a reality and its exciting because all of us on this forum have embraced high performance racing multihulls, and now the rest of the sailing world is now being introduced to multi racing at the highest level. Unbelievable. What else is truly remarkable is the speed at which these programs build working race boats. When someone told me Ben Hall had sold his wing Oracle earlier in the year, I didnt give it a second thought. Now they have a full size wing. Unbelievable. If its multi's and rigid wings, I'm considering going to go watch in person. Bill | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Rolf_Nilsen]
#193447 10/14/09 11:21 AM 10/14/09 11:21 AM |
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 749 Santa Cruz, CA SurfCityRacing
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Posts: 749 Santa Cruz, CA | The sad bit is that it is not going to make much of a difference to established monohull sailors if we get two giant multis with wings racing for the cup. I don't know... Every time we drag F18s to a monohull, yacht club event, I get about 20 calls the next day wondering what, "those Hobies with spinnakers were." I think the AC has been pretty good as far as spreading the multi word. Maybe there will be some spillover onto OUR racecourses from these giant multis? I hope! I think the old addage rings true: "There is only one thing worse than being talked about and that is NOT being talked about."-Oscar Wilde Stand by for info on the wing and various other things BMW/Oracle... Can't say much now. J | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: bvining]
#193462 10/14/09 02:16 PM 10/14/09 02:16 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake OP
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | Originally Posted By: sbflyerYes they could, pretty good couple of threads re. wings at SA in the Multihulls, with input from the C class guys who actually sound like they really know what they're talking about, including using wing with spin. They don't when class racing because of sail area restrictions btw...
I wouldn't say "spinnaker" ... more like a big code 0 or screacher. These boats will never have the apparent wind anywhere near 90 degrees.
Chances are you'll probably see a smaller jib/headsail when going upwind and the big screacher unwind for the downhill stuff. Yeah, thats what I meant to say. I cant believe that the AC looks like it is going to be sailed with multi's AND it looks like they are going to use rigid wing sails. If someone had suggested that 4 years ago I would have laughed in their face. Now this is looking like more and more of a reality and its exciting because all of us on this forum have embraced high performance racing multihulls, and now the rest of the sailing world is now being introduced to multi racing at the highest level. Unbelievable. What else is truly remarkable is the speed at which these programs build working race boats. When someone told me Ben Hall had sold his wing Oracle earlier in the year, I didnt give it a second thought. Now they have a full size wing. Unbelievable. If its multi's and rigid wings, I'm considering going to go watch in person. Bill I thought that too - and had laid some groundwork to go to Valencia. Now that it's in RAK, I'm really not interested. It's not that it's the mid-east - I've been there a couple of times...but I don't think RAK is going to have the accommodation structure for all this. It was only until two weeks ago that the had enough diesel generators to supply electricity to the whole town.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Jake]
#193478 10/14/09 03:16 PM 10/14/09 03:16 PM |
Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,584 +31NL Tony_F18
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Posts: 2,584 +31NL | Finally someone that actually talks about sailing! Sailing World's interview with Ed Baird. http://www2.worldpub.net/images/sw/4-SWPodcast091007.mp3 Some practical sailing tips in there as well, and some interesting stuff about Hydroptere. Anyone else think that LE is being an butt with this whole venue dispute? If he was so concerned about security maybe he shouldn't have so many offices in the middle-east? Yemen? Syria? I dont think BMW is very happy with him at the moment either http://www.oracle.com/global/me/corporate/contact.html | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Tony_F18]
#193487 10/14/09 03:55 PM 10/14/09 03:55 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 3,906 Clermont, FL, USA David Ingram
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Posts: 3,906 Clermont, FL, USA | Anyone else think that LE is being an butt with this whole venue dispute? If he was so concerned about security maybe he shouldn't have so many offices in the middle-east? Yemen? Syria? I dont think BMW is very happy with him at the moment either http://www.oracle.com/global/me/corporate/contact.html There is no doubt they are both a couple of hyper rich super sized douche bags. But, I do enjoy looking at their toys.
David Ingram F18 USA 242 http://www.solarwind.solar"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda "Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall "You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
| | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: David Ingram]
#193491 10/14/09 04:28 PM 10/14/09 04:28 PM | andrewscott
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[Re: ThunderMuffin]
#193533 10/15/09 02:44 AM 10/15/09 02:44 AM |
Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,528 Looking for a Job, I got credi... scooby_simon Hull Flying, Snow Sliding.... |
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
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Posts: 3,528 Looking for a Job, I got credi... | Annoyed at LE?!?!?!
How the kiss could you be annoyed at LE when it was EB that picked a stupid venue that
A) Has no wind and B) Is not deed compliant
??? The "security" thing is just another cherry topping to add to the litanies of shortcomings of RAK as an A/C venue. Hell they just got enough generators to power their rat-hole city just recently.
As for LE's business interests there - thats a whole different ballgame than sailing a boat called "USA" ... carrying American Flags (God Bless the Red White and Blue!) and in an event called the AMERICA'S Cup a mere hop, skip and a jump away from a country who is KNOWN to fund and support Islamic fundamentalist terrorism.
Just do it in valencia ffs. Do you know whay it's called the Americas cup?
F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD I also talk sport here | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: scooby_simon]
#193534 10/15/09 03:07 AM 10/15/09 03:07 AM |
Joined: May 2003 Posts: 4,451 West coast of Norway Rolf_Nilsen
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Posts: 4,451 West coast of Norway | Do you know whay it's called the Americas cup?
Dont bother. You are a euro weenie without a clue on terrorism, politics, the americas cup, rat hole cities, Leisure suit Larry, Ernesto Moneybags and just how god is blessing the USA. I dont quite see the relevance to wings. Take it to the hole known as "Drill, Baby, Drill part deux" Oh, I forgot to say Hitler. Not much patience for political discussions or even blaming today. But I would like to hear more about wings. | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Tony_F18]
#193537 10/15/09 04:21 AM 10/15/09 04:21 AM |
Joined: May 2003 Posts: 4,451 West coast of Norway Rolf_Nilsen
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Posts: 4,451 West coast of Norway | Hmm, tacking to work and gybing home again Cool thing! Not very practical, but cool. Hitler! Hole -> "Drill, Baby, Drill part deux" The british C-class team borrowed some resources from Airbus when doing their wing, but practical experience proved better. I dont know how well BMWs knowlegde would carry over to designing a wing, but hey, I hope to see some wings on those boats, racing, soon. | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Rolf_Nilsen]
#193538 10/15/09 04:36 AM 10/15/09 04:36 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 1,449 phill
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Posts: 1,449 | Personally, I hope the AC multis don't use a wing.
Just think that if you want to convert some mono traditionalists and lead them down the path to multis it has to be one step at a time.
A multi with conventional rig would be more likely to get their attention and imagination given their experience base. The same group would be more likely to rate the multi wing combination as something unrelated to what they do. I'm sure that we need them to see a link to get them thinking. Just the way I see it. Regards, Phill
I know that the voices in my head aint real, but they have some pretty good ideas. There is no such thing as a quick fix and I've never had free lunch!
| | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Tony_F18]
#193545 10/15/09 06:50 AM 10/15/09 06:50 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake OP
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | I'm not a big fan of the security card they're playing - I think that security IS an issue but it's not as dramatic as they are presenting. It certainly has no relevance to the Deed / ruling legality of the location. However, there is a lot of potential instability with the Iran / US relations and the landscape could be completely different in February. Add to that the fact that Ellison is Jewish...it puts a bit of a spin on the whole middle east thing on a personal level. I've been scrutinized just getting into Saudi Arabia because I had an Israel stamp in my passport - many places in the middle east do not allow Jewish people into the country.
I disagree with the opposing argument that "he has businesses there" as that's a completely different animal. This is a huge high profile event - you can't compare the security considerations of a large profile America's Cup campaign that spans a huge amount of water, including into some disputed Iranian territory, to holding a business office in Dubai. It's equally absurd.
I think, rather, the drama they've illuminated over the security ordeal is more of a legal tactic than a true belief...but who knows...rich billionaires get their panties in a twist over dumber things.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: ThunderMuffin]
#193559 10/15/09 08:52 AM 10/15/09 08:52 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake OP
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | Its called the America's Cup because the first boat that WON the thing was called "America"
You know, I might be a bleeding heart American Exceptionalist - but I'm not the ignorant "Stupid American" that you seem to think I am. Was that directed at me? I'm confused.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: Could DogZilla really have a wing?
[Re: Jake]
#193566 10/15/09 09:19 AM 10/15/09 09:19 AM |
Joined: Sep 2002 Posts: 3,224 Roanoke Island ,N.C. Team_Cat_Fever
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Posts: 3,224 Roanoke Island ,N.C. | Its called the America's Cup because the first boat that WON the thing was called "America"
You know, I might be a bleeding heart American Exceptionalist - but I'm not the ignorant "Stupid American" that you seem to think I am. Was that directed at me? I'm confused. Yeah, Jake, How dumb are you ? I hope Tad Kicks your butt. Just Joking. I'm pretty sure that was directed at Scooby Simon, a couple posts above yours. He was playing the "Americans are a bunch o' idiots" card. Rolf, I agree with you keep all the extraneous bile in the Drill thread.
"I said, now, I said ,pay attention boy!"
The cure for anything is salt water - sweat, tears, or the sea Isak Dinesen If a man is to be obsessed by something.... I suppose a boat is as good as anything... perhaps a bit better than most. E. B. White
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