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Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241533
12/16/11 11:21 PM
12/16/11 11:21 PM
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PeteCullum Offline OP
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Dave,

Earlier today I bought a 6' safety sausage on Amazon.

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Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241534
12/17/11 08:36 AM
12/17/11 08:36 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
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South Florida
joeyg Offline
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You can by a safety sausage at any local dive shop, and I believe that some west marine locations carry them.

Joe


After all, its not easy, banging your head against some mad buggers wall.
Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: joeyg] #241541
12/17/11 11:22 AM
12/17/11 11:22 AM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 713
WA, ID, MT
davefarmer Offline
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Thanks Joe!

Dave

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241584
12/19/11 12:21 AM
12/19/11 12:21 AM
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Posts: 805
Gainesville, FL 32607 USA
dacarls Offline
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About 50 cats got turned over in the big Mt. Dora spring race back in the day. The start was scary downwind blowing over 25, then it got way heavier! My Hobie 18 didn't just capsize after the first mark while missing others, it got flung upside down, and the mast stuck in the mud. It took us 20 minutes on one hull then the other trying to get it loose. On the way back in, the same thing happened again, and it took a powerboat to get the mast out. Nobody got hurt AFAIK. Yup- cast iron.


Dacarls:
A-class USA 196, USA 21, H18, H16
"Nothing that's any good works by itself. You got to make the damn thing work"- Thomas Edison
Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: dacarls] #241714
12/20/11 10:32 AM
12/20/11 10:32 AM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
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if it's blowing hard enough that you need a drogue to slow the boat down, it is likely you can right it singlehanded once it's pointed into the wind (by the drougue) and the main sheds some water.

Happened on my N20 in 18+ kts of breeze and medium chop (Florida Bay side). Didn't have drogue but I swam the bows enough to the wind that my crew (175#) could right the boat by himself. Once the wind got under the main and the water ran off, it was relatively straightforward to pull it upright. But it may have just been a good day, too...


Jay

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241716
12/20/11 10:48 AM
12/20/11 10:48 AM
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rexdenton Offline
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Pete,

Glad it worked out for the best...My worst case scenario is a squall, and I wanted to get a sea anchor before my last distance event. I was once sailing a N5.5 near home in a squall with 60 mph straight line wind , lightening, hail the works... solo. The ferocity of the wind and my point of sail left me no choice but to bear dead downwind to avoid the death zone and an assured capsize and whatever was to follow. While it was not to be the end of the world, it was pretty spooky, as riding it out was taking me onto a reef/island at extreme velocity, when, just as I was about to scuttle, as fast as it started, it was dead calm. (then it took me 2 h to sail about 1 mile). Where did you get your sea anchor, and what length line do you have attached to it?

One thought I would like to hear more about is helm. Most performance boats are pretty helm neutral and if they are righted, I figure they will pretty much sail away on their own. It has never happened to me. Any thoughts from the peanut gallery on this topic?

As for the diver marker...do those self-inflate?

+1 on the underneath grab line. A must have...

Last edited by rexdenton; 12/20/11 10:56 AM.

Nacra F18 #856
Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241720
12/20/11 01:17 PM
12/20/11 01:17 PM
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The idea of having an anchor, sea anchor, inflatable sausage, etc. may help in various situations but don't seem to be a very solid solution to any real situation especially when you are separated from the boat.

I think it's best for each person to have a VHF that is both waterproof and floats on them. EPIRB for offshore, but they do take a bit if time to be effective, as in USCG gets the signal, confirms its authenticity and get a rescue underway.

As far as getting a rescue fast and back in the race, a chase boat for the fleet is probably the best bet.


Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241734
12/20/11 05:41 PM
12/20/11 05:41 PM
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PeteCullum Offline OP
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Rex- I think the dive marker sausages require manual inflation.

Jim Zelmer recommended kicking up a rudder before righting the boat, so it is more likely to turn into the wind. This sounds like a good idea, but I haven't tried it yet. Does anyone know how well this works?

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241747
12/20/11 10:28 PM
12/20/11 10:28 PM
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WA, ID, MT
davefarmer Offline
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Pete,
Cabellla's has what they call drift socks, for fishermen, at reasonable prices.

Dave

Last edited by davefarmer; 12/20/11 10:29 PM.
Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: davefarmer] #241750
12/21/11 08:32 AM
12/21/11 08:32 AM
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Daytona Beach Florida
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orphan Offline
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Would the 3' sausage work? Much easier to inflate and smaller to carry(fits in most vest pockets) Still very visable.

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241791
12/22/11 12:17 PM
12/22/11 12:17 PM
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PeteCullum Offline OP
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Dave-thanks, I got one at another fishing supply place that sounds similar for about $45. In case anyone is interested I went with the 28" diameter.

Orphan-ya pays ya money and ya places ya bet. Let us know how it works out.

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241792
12/22/11 01:24 PM
12/22/11 01:24 PM
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Daytona Beach Florida
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Pete,
I have been using a small one( about 9" in diameter and 36" long) for diving for years. Helps the dive boat find you. Easy to inflate since it takes a lot less air and easy to wave around to get someones attention. The problem with the large tube is getting it inflated. Not a problem with a tank of air atttached to your back. Not so easy in large waves with wind and you are spending most of your energy trying to just keep from getting a mouth full of water. Now if you plan on using it as a raft you might want the large one.
And I don't understand the diameter issue. The idea is the length so you can get it up high for soemone to see.
Orphan.

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241795
12/22/11 02:50 PM
12/22/11 02:50 PM
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Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA
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Coming in from off shore fishing...looking for a red buoy 18'+ high and bigger in diameter than my boat is wide, with a known location...is still hard to see with 3-5' seas...from a distance.

Based on my experience the bigger the better.

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: Seeker] #241797
12/22/11 04:02 PM
12/22/11 04:02 PM
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Posts: 465
FL
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On an offshore distance race between PR and Culebra, I was rescued using a signal mirror on a cat with two sheared/lost rudders.
Put a mirror or reflective tape on top of tube?

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241798
12/22/11 04:37 PM
12/22/11 04:37 PM
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Orphan- The 28" diameter refers to the mouth of the drogue I bought. I got a 6' safety-tube, which I believe has a 9" dia. but I haven't received it yet. You might be right that 3' tall is sufficient, but I went with the 6' one largely because it was recommended by an experienced Tybee racer.

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: PeteCullum] #241811
12/23/11 09:49 AM
12/23/11 09:49 AM
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Posts: 302
Daytona Beach Florida
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yellow or red? I always get yellow because red does not show up for color blind people.

Re: Seperation Irritation at Steeplechase [Re: Team_Cat_Fever] #241826
12/23/11 06:24 PM
12/23/11 06:24 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 733
Home is where the harness is.....
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Home is where the harness is.....
Originally Posted by Team_Cat_Fever
Originally Posted by pgp
None of you are considering tethering yourselves to the boat?


All of this has been gone over dozens of times here. Boat flips, tether tangles, you drown. Not to mention the tether inhibits your mobility enough to increase the probablility of flipping .


+1 on this. Also, ask Randy why he wears inflatable suspenders instead of a vest.

I was NEARLY separated going around Hatteras b/c I was shoved under water by the skipper of the boat I was on. It was a typical slow round up and capsize spinnaker flip. I had my escape route and was executing it, but suddenly he jumped on my back as I was lowering to the water. His weight forced me deep enough that I ended up going under the hull. I popped up ~2-3' from the bottom of the boat and started swimming like crazy. You add VHF, EPIRB, camel back, GPSs and the rest of the typical distance racing gear we wear along with a dry suit, a danforth as nothing on us at that point.... (get it anchor?) With the sand bars at the Cape, I'd go from swimming to running back to swimming very quickly. The breeze and current were offshore and luckily I was able to grab the TOP batten on the main as the mast pivoted by. I vowed that the only way I was letting go was if that batten broke off in my hand. Had I not held on, I was head to England w/o my passport, lol.

The point I wanted to make is that when sailing with skippers that I trust and especially the one I spend most of my on the water time with, we always have a plan/system. I'm usually the larger of the two and therefore am also the last person on the boat. As such, the skipper plans to roll himself up onto the boat as it rights while I always plan to have a solid hold somewhere and jump on as soon as he’s out of the way. This gives us a man on deck to steer if I can't hold on. Knock on wood, to date that has never happened and I've been upside down in some gnarly stuff on very light boats.

Which brings me to my last point which we were discussing a couple of weeks ago. Trust your partner and make sure that they're competent. I learned my lesson with the Worrell and never would I sail with that particular person EVER again OR do a race like that w/o someone that I would trust with my life! I know that my skipper can get us out of almost any jam and he knows that I can do that same. Among other things, we can both run the boat single handed and are both big enough to pull the other on board. We planned to do the Cuba race and that level of trust is a HUGE comfort to me.

In short, communication is key and IMO being prepared for all hell to break loose is part of that discussion. You can't prevent bad luck, but you can make good luck happen sometimes. I think the orange buoy and small drogue are both good ideas if they're small enough to not cause a problem on their own. Also, at one point Garmin Rhino’s were getting popular b/c they were radios with GPS that could send locations between the two, something else to consider.

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