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Re: vacuum bag [Re: pgp] #249553
06/14/12 07:45 AM
06/14/12 07:45 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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Rolf_Nilsen  Offline
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West coast of Norway
How about venturie vacum pumps?

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: vacuum bag [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #249556
06/14/12 08:02 AM
06/14/12 08:02 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen
How about venturie vacum pumps?


Decent, but they really consume a lot of compressed air. They are good when you need to remove a lot of air quickly or have a very leaky setup. I have a couple of them and used them in conjunction with my mechanical vane pump when I reinforced a failing block basement wall with uni directional carbon.


Jake Kohl
Re: vacuum bag [Re: carlbohannon] #249557
06/14/12 08:04 AM
06/14/12 08:04 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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Originally Posted by carlbohannon
Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen
Originally Posted by Jake
There are a lot of economical vacuum pumps available now for around $100 US that are good for building composites (but maybe not for HVAC work).




Links? Ebay? smile


try:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=gast+vacuum+pump&_sacat=0

Gast is a common industrial brand in North America. There are others.

I bought a oil less rotary vane pump with tanks, manifold, gauge, and pressure controller for ~$100 10 years ago. I see several similar units in the link.

Suggestion, use a filter. Many of the small units have a short life without them. I use a jar with paper towel media backed up with an inline water filter.


I use this one:
http://www.veneersupplies.com/products/Vacuum-Filter-5-Micron-High-Flow.html

This pump is plenty for doing composite work:
http://www.harborfreight.com/25-cfm-vacuum-pump-98076.html


Jake Kohl
Re: vacuum bag [Re: Jake] #249559
06/14/12 08:29 AM
06/14/12 08:29 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Rolf_Nilsen  Offline
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West coast of Norway
Originally Posted by Jake
Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen
How about venturie vacum pumps?


Decent, but they really consume a lot of compressed air. They are good when you need to remove a lot of air quickly or have a very leaky setup. I have a couple of them and used them in conjunction with my mechanical vane pump when I reinforced a failing block basement wall with uni directional carbon.


I have one of those walls myself. A crack is forming and it is beginning to buckle ever so slightly inwards.

How did you prepare the surface and apply the carbon?

Re: vacuum bag [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #249560
06/14/12 08:31 AM
06/14/12 08:31 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen
Originally Posted by Jake
Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen
How about venturie vacum pumps?


Decent, but they really consume a lot of compressed air. They are good when you need to remove a lot of air quickly or have a very leaky setup. I have a couple of them and used them in conjunction with my mechanical vane pump when I reinforced a failing block basement wall with uni directional carbon.


I have one of those walls myself. A crack is forming and it is beginning to buckle ever so slightly inwards.

How did you prepare the surface and apply the carbon?


http://www.teamseacats.com/2008/06/19/carbon-and-concrete/


Jake Kohl
Re: vacuum bag [Re: pgp] #249565
06/14/12 09:04 AM
06/14/12 09:04 AM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA
Seeker Offline
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I have used a 25 gallon Craftsman shop vac on numerous occasions, running it for up to 6 hrs straight without it burning up...but cant' guarantee yours won't....not a very controlled way but it gets the job done...unlike a dedicated vacuum pump it will pull all the air out of a big bag in seconds...We use to use one to evacuate all
the air out of large projects before turning on the dedicated vacuum pump.

I like to note that when I used the shop vac itself for vacuum bagging I cleaned it completely out and ran it without the filter in place...it would suck so hard that the HD base would suck the sidewalks of the plastic tub. Not the best way but if you want to do it on the cheap and your resin jell time is less than 1-1/2 hrs it will do.

Regards,
Robert

Re: vacuum bag [Re: pgp] #249567
06/14/12 09:33 AM
06/14/12 09:33 AM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 678
Palm Beach County
TheManShed Offline
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Palm Beach County
This is my current Vacuum pump setup the pump is also from Harbor Freight. If you watch for sales and get an Insiders Club Card the price is not too bad.
Thinking about changing the pump system some to not work the pump as much - but more the method as I pulled too much epoxy last time when I had a perfect seal with my bag and smaller parts.
I started working on it before I left to go work on new cruise ship build a couple of months ago. Iíve been back to the US for week and Iím still weeding through the ďhoney doĒ list. Iím also interviewing for a new job my current job keeps me too busy and canít seem to find time for my boat and that is starting to bother me. Also is picture of the ďBongĒ I built to capture epoxy and have some extra vacuum volume. I have the conversion of the vacuum pump and building the bong on my website http://www.themanshed.com/tms-20-trimaran/8-18-09-layup-and-vacuum-bagging.html I hope that helps.


Attached Files
P1010087[1].JPG (31 downloads)
Last edited by TheManShed; 06/14/12 09:39 AM. Reason: Image

Mike Shappell
www.themanshed.com
TMS-20 Builder
G-Cat 5.7 - Current Boat
NACRA 5.2 - early 70's

Re: vacuum bag [Re: phill] #249571
06/14/12 10:36 AM
06/14/12 10:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
pgp Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
pgp  Offline OP
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Okay Phil, I'm sold. But, I'll buy something off the shelf, trying to engineer my own rig would be a disaster.

laugh You may be getting a PM or two when I get lost. Or, hell I may as chronicle my little saga right here. This crowd can always use a good laugh.

Right now my hands are full so there'll be a little delay.


Pete Pollard
Blade 702

'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: vacuum bag [Re: TheManShed] #249572
06/14/12 10:40 AM
06/14/12 10:40 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
pgp Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
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Originally Posted by TheManShed
This is my current Vacuum pump setup the pump is also from Harbor Freight. If you watch for sales and get an Insiders Club Card the price is not too bad.
Thinking about changing the pump system some to not work the pump as much - but more the method as I pulled too much epoxy last time when I had a perfect seal with my bag and smaller parts.
I started working on it before I left to go work on new cruise ship build a couple of months ago. Iíve been back to the US for week and Iím still weeding through the ďhoney doĒ list. Iím also interviewing for a new job my current job keeps me too busy and canít seem to find time for my boat and that is starting to bother me. Also is picture of the ďBongĒ I built to capture epoxy and have some extra vacuum volume. I have the conversion of the vacuum pump and building the bong on my website http://www.themanshed.com/tms-20-trimaran/8-18-09-layup-and-vacuum-bagging.html I hope that helps.



Mike, you guys amaze me! I wouldn't come up with that in a million years...


Pete Pollard
Blade 702

'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: vacuum bag [Re: Jake] #249577
06/14/12 12:35 PM
06/14/12 12:35 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway


Great stuff Jake, thanks! I might have to try the same thign to save myself some serious digging and construction work.

Re: vacuum bag [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #249588
06/14/12 01:28 PM
06/14/12 01:28 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 190
B
Bille Offline
member
Bille  Offline
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B

Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 190
Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen


Great stuff Jake, thanks! ...


YEP -- Great stuff !!

Only change i'd make is to use Carbon-UNI instead
of the woven carbon tape that's pictured. UNI places ALL the strength
in one direction , unlike the tape that strengthens
on both the + - 90deg. Ya really don't Need the carbon
in the cross-fibers, and the fibers are actually about
30% stronger in compression and tension loads,when NOT woven.

Bille

Re: vacuum bag [Re: pgp] #249589
06/14/12 01:36 PM
06/14/12 01:36 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 190
B
Bille Offline
member
Bille  Offline
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B

Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 190
One of my vacuum pumps for small jobs, was made
from the compressor off an old refrigerator.
It's a 110v compressor. An AC compressor would work
but i'm Scared of 220v.

It sucks the air out of a Beer-keg, and has a one
way valve in line to keep the vacuum in the keg.

Add a valve and an adjustable Hg switch and Ya got something that
can pull almost a full atmosphere and only run for
5 minutes every hour if Ya got a good tight seal on
the bag.

Re: vacuum bag [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #249603
06/14/12 02:47 PM
06/14/12 02:47 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Originally Posted by Rolf_Nilsen


Great stuff Jake, thanks! I might have to try the same thign to save myself some serious digging and construction work.


It's held up well now for four years. In the first following winter (2008), my buddy swore the wall was moving and was comparing it against an open stud wall he built in front of the block wall. I didn't believe that was the case because the carbon and epoxy looked like the day they cured but I couldn't convince him that his studs were moving. To prove it, I epoxied a glass slide (laboratory type that is used with a microscope) to the wall on both sides of the crack between two of the carbon spans in the most offending area. It's still intact and hasn't broken loose or cracked proving that the block wall has not moved at all. His stud wall, however, appears to bow/move as the humidity changes in his leaky basement (at least the crown in the studs are in the correct direction! ;-).


Jake Kohl
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