Announcements
New Discussions
Best spinnaker halyard line material?
by '81 Hobie 16 Lac Leman. 03/31/24 10:31 AM
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Worrell in 2004? #25046
10/13/03 09:57 AM
10/13/03 09:57 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
MauganN20 Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
MauganN20  Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
With the abrupt cancellation of last year's race, will the race go on this coming spring? I only ask because I have not read any press releases or statements from the establishment regarding the race. The latest press release on the worrell1k website is about the million dollar purse for the winner.

Curious, and somewhat concerned :P

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: MauganN20] #25047
10/13/03 11:29 AM
10/13/03 11:29 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
We haven't heard from Mike Worrell, and it is hard for me to imagine the race being run again by him.

However, that wonderful coastline is still there. Mike Worrell doesn't own it, he didn't create it. He gets the credit for being the one who recognized the potential of that coastline for a race like this and for making the race happen for many years. The Worrell 1000 was one of the best things that has happened for catamarans. It would never have happened without Michael Worrell.

But if he is not going to be doing the race any more, I figure it's up for grabs. Will somebody else pick up this fumbled ball and run with it? (Sorry, I'm forced to watch way too much football this time of the year.)

Anyway, it would be interesting to ask everybody: If YOU were in charge of this race, how would you do it, and what types of boat(s) would you allow, and what would the entry fee be and what would it include, etc., etc., etc....?"

I know that lots of past Worrell 1000 sailors have their own ideas about how they would like to see the race run.

The problem is that nobody wants to step up and take the responsibility and the work of doing it.

Actually, I think there are a lot of older sailors who would be able to get together to put on the "1000," because they no longer want to actually be out there on the water.

Tad, I know you are curious, and concerned, because you are one of the young people who were hoping to someday race in it.

It is ironic that I am rooting for the "1000", under whatever name, to continue, since I have always been so opposed to the danger factors. But on the other hand, I think it is important for sailors to have goals to shoot for. Participating in and surviving the Worrell 1000 was the biggest goal we had.

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Mary] #25048
10/13/03 04:56 PM
10/13/03 04:56 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 591
Bradenton, FL
Sycho15 Offline
addict
Sycho15  Offline
addict

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 591
Bradenton, FL
If I ran the "1000"... I'd make it an open production-class event for boats 20-18'. Let the catamaran producers supply their boats and pit them against the rest to see who really makes the fastest-yet-still-durable cat on the market.

I'd want to see some Tornados with Olypic-class sailors competing against the latest-and-greatest.


G-Cat 5.7M #583 (sail # currently 100) in Bradenton, FL Hobie 14T
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Sycho15] #25049
10/13/03 05:04 PM
10/13/03 05:04 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Would your scoring be 'the first one to Virgina Beach'? or would you handicap?


Jake Kohl
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Mary] #25050
10/13/03 05:44 PM
10/13/03 05:44 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 248
Colorado
SteveT Offline
enthusiast
SteveT  Offline
enthusiast

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 248
Colorado
The (insert name here) 1000 is "The Race" for beach catamarans. It should be a no-holds-barred cat fight unrestricted to one brand or model of boat. By opening the event it creates a proving ground and test track for the newest products and sailing techniques in the toughest conditions. Spinakers, large headsails, new sail shapes and countless durability improvements found their way to the mainstream (or were discarded as ineffective) by way of The 1000. Forget offering a huge purse. Most competitors won't line up for the money, but will flock to the beach for an adventure. In addition, manufacturers should be thrilled to pony up some bucks to sponsor a race that tests their products to the limit. What better advertising than finishing the Worrell in one piece - or better still: Winning. The 1000 isn't dead, it's just sleeping until a sailing junkie with business skills steps up and plants the kiss that wakes this beauty.


H-20 #896
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: SteveT] #25051
10/13/03 05:59 PM
10/13/03 05:59 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 74
Reno, NV
pschmalz Offline
journeyman
pschmalz  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 74
Reno, NV
I propose that everyone on record as having said "I'd rather race sunfish one-design then catamarans on portsmouth" be forced to sail the ??? 1000 on a sunfish.

Sorry for that - I just smell a one design/box rule/handicap flamefest coming soon to this thread, and I wanted to get in on the action early.

Pete Schmalzer
NACRA 5.8 NA/MN 1302

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: pschmalz] #25052
10/13/03 06:17 PM
10/13/03 06:17 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Quote
I propose that everyone on record as having said "I'd rather race sunfish one-design then catamarans on portsmouth" be forced to sail the ??? 1000 on a sunfish


I think I'm the only one on record saying that. PLEASE don't make me sail a thousand miles on a Sunfish!

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: MauganN20] #25053
10/13/03 06:22 PM
10/13/03 06:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 48
Georgia and Texas
Jim Stone Offline
newbie
Jim Stone  Offline
newbie

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 48
Georgia and Texas
I hope this has changed, but the last I heard (last week)was that nobody as yet has received a refund from Mike Worrell...that's 36 teams at $5,000.00 each. I did hear he is still trying to market the race from several different sources close to the race.

My advice for now is to sail the Tybee 500 and before long the guys from the Outer Banks will have the second 500 "atlantic challenge" organized once they sort out the Hurricane damage. Then you can do one or both of the 500 mile segments.

The Tybee has a great vibe and was a lot of fun. I've been involved with both races as a sailor, ground crew, and team sponsor. They are both great races, but we now only have one to choose from.

As far as race format and boat selection go... the Tybee 500 format was great and I think F18 and F20 or Production 20's makes the most sense to me both for safety and affordability.

That's my $.02

Jim Stone

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Mary] #25054
10/13/03 06:40 PM
10/13/03 06:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 74
Reno, NV
pschmalz Offline
journeyman
pschmalz  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 74
Reno, NV
Just teasing you Mary. I'm sure lots of other people have said it, so you won't be alone out there.

It might even be kind of fun if you have the right mind-set (and a lot of vacation time).

Pete Schmalzer
NACRA 5.8 NA/MN 1302

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Sycho15] #25055
10/13/03 07:59 PM
10/13/03 07:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Quote
[/i]If I ran the "1000"...[/i] I'd make it an open production-class event for boats 20-18'. Let the catamaran producers supply their boats and pit them against the rest to see who really makes the fastest-yet-still-durable cat on the market.


Why do you think manufacturers should supply boats?

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: SteveT] #25056
10/13/03 09:18 PM
10/13/03 09:18 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Here you go: how about both...The current Tybee structure (Production 20's, F18, F18ht) but add an open class that's an all out "build it and go" philosophy but with a few rules (like length). But then you have to figure how to prevent the nutjob who slaps a 50' mast on a 22' boat that will never survive offshore.


Jake Kohl
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Jake] #25057
10/14/03 03:34 AM
10/14/03 03:34 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
MauganN20 Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
MauganN20  Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
I'm interested in it not only because I want to compete in it one day, but because its one of the only events that hits the mainstream press concerning catamarans and extreme sailing in general.

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Mary] #25058
10/14/03 10:31 AM
10/14/03 10:31 AM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA
Seeker Offline
addict
Seeker  Offline
addict

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA
The manufactures would probably be reluctant to take the risk…A manufacturer can brag all they want about how well their boat is constructed and use their marketing machine to sell the product. But…when you put your reputation on the line in a race like the 1000 in head to head with your competitor’s, two nasty things can happen. 1) You can have the strongest boat out there and get picked off in big shore break by a freak set, or human error. The only thing most people will hear is of the winner…and will assume that it must be the strongest/fastest boat. Yours may be stronger, lighter, have a racing life of three times that of your competition, but if you don’t finish the race because of breakdown, you will be fighting an up hill battle trying to sell your boat on the feature of superior construction.
2) If you are a manufacturer and know your boat is not up to the challenge, the last thing you want is to see pictures of your boat breaking up on National TV/Magazines/Internet Sites, while your competition goes merrily along.

By keeping it one design recently, they have avoided many of these embarrassments. If all boats are of the same size, make and model, when one breaks up it is attributed to the rough conditions, not always the boat itself. A quarter of the fleet could go down and the chosen boat would still take on the mystique of having been a Worrell's 1000 boat.

It would seem that there is just not enough incentive for a manufacture to take that high a risk for so small a potential profit.

It would be nice to see the race open up and breath a little more, open it up to any catamaran 20 feet and under, no beam limit, no sail limit…Let the Atlantic be the rule maker… this could (once again) be the developmental proving ground for new ideas and innovation.

Have TV crews follow the teams in a kind of Eco-challenge format...with all the adventure/reality showes on TV lately it would probably draw a huge audience. By the end of the week catamaran sales could go up 10 fold...I can't believe no one thought of this before????? Now that could get the manufactures attention!

Bob

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Seeker] #25059
10/14/03 10:56 AM
10/14/03 10:56 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
MauganN20 Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
MauganN20  Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
That eco-challenge thing would be great, especially if you could have onboard cameras and mic's.

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: MauganN20] #25060
10/14/03 11:30 AM
10/14/03 11:30 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Those wireless things don't have much range and keeping up with a spread out fleet of mics and cameras would be nearly impossible. Besides, short of watching someone try to eat a sandwich while on the trapeze there's not a lot of viewer realizable drama happening in distance racing. To someone who doesn't know or care about the very technical details, it's just a bunch of straight line sailing.

The 'general public style' drama happens getting on and off the beach, the quick racing immediately after launching, and the preparations / strategy planning beforehand.


Jake Kohl
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Jake] #25061
10/14/03 12:08 PM
10/14/03 12:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 612
Cape Town, South Africa
Steve_Kwiksilver Offline
addict
Steve_Kwiksilver  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 612
Cape Town, South Africa
"Would your scoring be 'the first one to Virgina Beach'? or would you handicap? "

How about F16, F18 & F20 : 3 classes, a winner in each class. Bring your own boat, keep the entry fee realistic. Most guys just want to do the race, never mind win it. The heroes will all sail F20 for line honours, the rest will be there for the experience (Oh, I forgot - Mike Worrell made it clear in a reply e-mail to me that this race was only for the Superheroes, normal sailors need not apply.)
But then, If he`s not involved, it may just be a good thing for us mere mortals.

Cheers
Steve

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Jake] #25062
10/14/03 12:11 PM
10/14/03 12:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 591
Bradenton, FL
Sycho15 Offline
addict
Sycho15  Offline
addict

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 591
Bradenton, FL
Why would I want the manufacturers to provide the boats?

#1- To make it possible for the "average joe" to afford to race in the Worrell 1000 competatively. Not everyone can afford to take their $10k toy and push it past it's limits through the worst the Atlantic can dish out.

#2- to get a boat with a known build-quality. Say there are a dozen boats competing, and four manufacturers ponied up three boats each. Certain boats will be more prone to certain problems- in both sailing ability per the conditions, and construction quality/ruggedness -than others. If one manufacture's boats all had their daggerboard trunks rip out and their rudders sheer off, while the rest of the fleet suffered less damages, chances are there is a design flaw in that boat.

#3- I'm not saying only allow new boats from manufacturers. If someone has the money and desire to race their personal toy against the other boats, then by all means let them! I just wouldn't want one-off $50k customs competing in the race and turning it into a "who's got deeper pockets" event.

Then again... with no cash purse -only bragging rights to claim when it's all over- if someone wanted to flog a $50k one-off to see if it was any better than the production boats of the day... I sure wouldn't stop them!

Last edited by Sycho15; 10/14/03 04:26 PM.

G-Cat 5.7M #583 (sail # currently 100) in Bradenton, FL Hobie 14T
Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Jake] #25063
10/15/03 10:13 AM
10/15/03 10:13 AM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA
Seeker Offline
addict
Seeker  Offline
addict

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA

Jake…don’t you think having a video cam on board multiple boats punching through the surf, pitch polling, Sails shreading,hitting a shark at night tearing out your centerboard case, etc is not enough to keep people interested?…It’s all in the presentation…heck people sit home and watch bowling and golf…and that’s right up there with watching the grass grow in the back yard.Tell me that cat sailing...especially at that level, wouldn't pull people in...

A 5 or 6 teams would be followed throughout the event giving the behind the scene story. Bringing the human factor into the mix. It would be a hit for both the TV network and the cat sailing community…it might very well be the CPR Catamaran sailing has been looking for…what that guys name that does the Eco-challenge and Survivor? He would be the one to pull it off.

Bob

Re: Worrell in 2004? [Re: Seeker] #25064
10/15/03 10:41 AM
10/15/03 10:41 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Sure - but who's footing the bill for the gas and salary for the five or six power boats following each of the teams equiped with wireless equipment 6 to 16 hours a day to try and capture the 5 seconds of excitement that may or may not happen? Who's driving the boats and who's training them to stay out of the way of the sailors? Most of the good stuff would be lost anyway because unless it's a huge power boat, they're not going to go out in half the stuff we enjoy anyway! The odds are not good on capturing the excitement offshore.

However, you bring up a good point through the surf. That would be easier to capture wirelessly since everyone is congregated. With just the before launch, launch, and arrival I'm sure there's enough good stuff happening for 20 to 30 minutes of TV worthy stuff per leg. Don't get me wrong - I'm all for getting some on TV coverage for a race like the Worrell or Tybee.


Jake Kohl
Helmet cams [Re: Jake] #25065
10/17/03 03:16 PM
10/17/03 03:16 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
waterbug_wpb  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Jake and others,

We're (well, several other drunks from the dark fleet) working on cheap (relatively) systems to obtain volumes of footage to edit into something that might actually be viewable by the non-sailing crowds. Using bullet cams (about $150) and old video recorders, we got around the transmission stuff, but take on about 2.5 kilos extra weight.

Should be experimenting more at Hiram's Haul if I can make the camcorder more waterproof (they have a Sony Watchman that would work - but I'm not going to drop $800 on this just yet).

And yes, 2 hours of the back of my crew's head (or the jib telltales) isn't what I would call "Must see TV". But a few minutes of close calls, crash tacks, flips, and other stuff might make a video highlight format work. And I've opted not to take a microphone, because we all know how prolific Team Aqua Assault's use of "colorful metaphores" can be... 30 minutes of censor beeps would probably drive viewers away...

Obviously, it is looking like closely fought bouy races would provide more action (or at least more items on the viewer) and more opportunities to place fixed cameras (bouys, RC boat, etc.) cheaply.

If we can get the weight down, fixed and helmet cams would work best, but we're taking baby steps along the lines of the America's Cup coverage.

With Alex's GPS tracker in the old W-1000 on the TB boat, and a few helmet cams, we could do something (much smaller scale, of course) akin to the AC with the computer graphics and on-board action, but again - it would only end up about 30 minutes of useable footage for that race....

Your thoughts?


Jay

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Damon Linkous 

Search

Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 654 guests, and 156 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Darryl, zorro, CraigJ, PaulEddo2, AUS180
8150 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics22,405
Posts267,056
Members8,150
Most Online2,167
Dec 19th, 2022
--Advertisement--
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1