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Slowing down the spinnaker snuff #254057
10/28/12 05:23 AM
10/28/12 05:23 AM
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waynemarlow Offline OP
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Has anybody devised a series of blocks or such like to slow the descent of the top of the spinnaker on snuffing. As a single hander we don't have enough hands to slow the top of the spinnaker to prevent that big wadge of sail hitting the top of the snuffer if we simply let the uphaul go. Slowing down the descent would also help keep all the sheets etc in the right place rather than as some times happens, getting wrapped and tangled on the way down.

On the way up we need the uphaul to be as free as possible so any system needs to be almost directional.

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Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254081
10/28/12 07:29 PM
10/28/12 07:29 PM
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Palm Harbor, FL
daniel_t Offline
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I'm not sure what you mean by "that big wadge of sail hitting the top of the snuffer," but one tip I picked up somewhere on the net is to tie a stopper knot in your downhaul line about 3 feet or sow below the top attachment point. That keeps the attachment points along the spinnaker from bunching up when you are trying to haul the kite into the snuffer so that it goes in more smooth and fast so I can keep up with the dropping head.

I sail single handed too and this helps me tremendously. Maybe it will help you too.


Daniel T.
Taipan F16 - USA 213
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254089
10/29/12 07:18 AM
10/29/12 07:18 AM

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MN3
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i use a bowline knot (about 8") & stopper ball on my retrieval line too, to separate the top and middle patch on my mid pole system. if i used more than 8" the head of my spin would not go in the bag.

I do have my retrieval line reeved around 1 small block and 1 small metal ring on my rear beam/hiking straps to a. slow down my line when dropping & b. to avoid the line from twisting up. this all works pretty well.

Last edited by MN3; 10/29/12 07:19 AM.
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254090
10/29/12 07:34 AM
10/29/12 07:34 AM
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Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
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Are you running a single line, or separate tack?


I'm boatless.
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254092
10/29/12 08:19 AM
10/29/12 08:19 AM
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Solomon's Island, MD
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samc99us Offline
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Essentially we're talking about an extension line the runs from the top patch to the retrieval line, and the retrieval line no longer goes to the top patch?

Another trick is to use a line at the bottom patch. Run 12" piece of line with a stopper knot through the patch, and run the retrieval line through a ring on this line, then through the bottom patch and on up. This helps get the foot of the sail into the snuffer hoop sooner.


Scorpion F18
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: samc99us] #254098
10/29/12 09:18 AM
10/29/12 09:18 AM
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Wilmington,NC
Dlennard Offline
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Originally Posted by samc99us
Essentially we're talking about an extension line the runs from the top patch to the retrieval line, and the retrieval line no longer goes to the top patch?

Another trick is to use a line at the bottom patch. Run 12" piece of line with a stopper knot through the patch, and run the retrieval line through a ring on this line, then through the bottom patch and on up. This helps get the foot of the sail into the snuffer hoop sooner.


What? That does not make sense. If you run both lines through the bottom patch how does this work? If you meant the 12" line on the clew that is to pull more sheet into the bag and does need a longer halyard.

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: Dlennard] #254099
10/29/12 10:22 AM
10/29/12 10:22 AM
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Solomon's Island, MD
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samc99us Offline
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Hmmm that's probably what is. Time to look at some rigging guides, been a while since I've really setup the mid-pole snuffer correctly.


Scorpion F18
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254100
10/29/12 10:40 AM
10/29/12 10:40 AM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
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Originally Posted by waynemarlow
Has anybody devised a series of blocks or such like to slow the descent of the top of the spinnaker on snuffing. As a single hander we don't have enough hands to slow the top of the spinnaker to prevent that big wadge of sail hitting the top of the snuffer if we simply let the uphaul go. Slowing down the descent would also help keep all the sheets etc in the right place rather than as some times happens, getting wrapped and tangled on the way down.

On the way up we need the uphaul to be as free as possible so any system needs to be almost directional.


maybe some light tension on the halyard (under the outside of your foot, perhaps?) to keep the head of the spin from nose-diving into the water/hoop?


Jay

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waterbug_wpb] #254106
10/29/12 01:21 PM
10/29/12 01:21 PM

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I have tried this ...
there are just too many things going on at the same time to effectively "throttle" a thin line under foot. Especially if your boat is rounding up on you, as both your hands are busy pulling in retrieval lines (and anything else that gets fouled)

Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
Originally Posted by waynemarlow
Has anybody devised a series of blocks or such like to slow the descent of the top of the spinnaker on snuffing. As a single hander we don't have enough hands to slow the top of the spinnaker to prevent that big wadge of sail hitting the top of the snuffer if we simply let the uphaul go. Slowing down the descent would also help keep all the sheets etc in the right place rather than as some times happens, getting wrapped and tangled on the way down.

On the way up we need the uphaul to be as free as possible so any system needs to be almost directional.


maybe some light tension on the halyard (under the outside of your foot, perhaps?) to keep the head of the spin from nose-diving into the water/hoop?

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254108
10/29/12 01:45 PM
10/29/12 01:45 PM
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Tony_F18 Offline
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I guess you could fit a small ratchet somewhere.
You could use a thicker halyard/smaller block but that means hoisting is also harder.
Best thing is too just train your arms to retrieve faster. smile

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254113
10/29/12 07:10 PM
10/29/12 07:10 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
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Arizona
AzCat Offline
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Arizona
How do you have the haulyard run? Does it run from the bag through a grommet in the tramp , to a block at the rear of the tramp, to the haulyard swivle and up the mast?

When I set up my ^.0 system, I didnt have the block at the rear of the tramp, and the swivle was on the mast. I had to keep the haulyard in my hand and brake it while i was pulling on the retrival end. Worked pretty good, but to teach crew to do it took a little time. I kept both lines in my right hand, and pulled with my left.

On my inter, with the grommet in the tramp and a turning block on the tramp, i can use both hands to pill like hell, and there is enoughy resistance that the kite dosnt just fall.


Auscat MKV 444 A class
NACRA I-20- 440/CATHATKA
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: AzCat] #254120
10/30/12 03:48 AM
10/30/12 03:48 AM
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waynemarlow Offline OP
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I had quite a complicated system of under slung snuffer but had the rigging with so little friction that letting the uphaul go, if you had to at all make any adjustmant to either heading or release some thing tha had a minor snag, the sail would be down around the water before you knew it.

Tried the foot on the down haul, couldn't get consistancy and I would either end up with too much or too little. Tried the feed and retrieve but this really slows things down and you end up just doubling the retrieve time. Also by a not even feed I found my Spinlock jammer was locking on at times.

The only way I can think about getting some sort of constant friction is a series of blocks or rings or putting a small ratchet into the system somewhere.

I am glad others have experianced similar problems as I was starting to think it was just me.

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254121
10/30/12 07:13 AM
10/30/12 07:13 AM

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MN3
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Originally Posted by waynemarlow
The only way I can think about getting some sort of constant friction is a series of blocks or rings or putting a small ratchet into the system somewhere.


I think a thicker line would help a lot

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254123
10/30/12 08:23 AM
10/30/12 08:23 AM
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Portland, Maine
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ThunderMuffin Offline
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When I've singlehanded my 20, I've used the bottom of my foot as a "clutch" on the halyard to slow the descent. You gotta be careful though because doing it in the same spot on the tramp over and over again could easily put a burn hole in it.

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: ] #254125
10/30/12 08:29 AM
10/30/12 08:29 AM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
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Originally Posted by MN3
I have tried this ...
there are just too many things going on at the same time to effectively "throttle" a thin line under foot.


It seems I'm always somehow sitting on the halyard during a retreival anyway, which solves that snuffing problem at least. But slows the snuff altogether causing mayhem on the rest of the boat (single or double-handed) smile


Jay

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waterbug_wpb] #254135
10/30/12 10:15 AM
10/30/12 10:15 AM

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MN3
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MN3
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+1


Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
Originally Posted by MN3
I have tried this ...
there are just too many things going on at the same time to effectively "throttle" a thin line under foot.


It seems I'm always somehow sitting on the halyard during a retreival anyway, which solves that snuffing problem at least. But slows the snuff altogether causing mayhem on the rest of the boat (single or double-handed) smile

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254136
10/30/12 10:20 AM
10/30/12 10:20 AM

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MN3
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MN3
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now that i think about it, there is a tramp system that Catman uses with a bungee and small plastic loop(s) that take up the spin sheet slack when the spin is snuffed.. (different than the one mentioned above) i don't know if that setup helps during dousing.

Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254185
10/31/12 11:24 AM
10/31/12 11:24 AM
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Posts: 1,658
Florida Suncoast, Dunedin Caus...
catman Offline
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I had my spin haylard run thru the the sail track over the top of the mast and down to a block.

My haylard cleat was at the bottom of the mast. Not the most ideal set up for bouys racing but, the best part was the slight friction on the haylard when snuffing. Just enough to keep the sail from dropping into the water.


Have Fun
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waterbug_wpb] #254231
11/01/12 10:27 PM
11/01/12 10:27 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,383
Kingston SE South Australia
JeffS Offline
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Kingston SE South Australia
Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
Originally Posted by MN3
I have tried this ...
there are just too many things going on at the same time to effectively "throttle" a thin line under foot.


It seems I'm always somehow sitting on the halyard during a retreival anyway, which solves that snuffing problem at least. But slows the snuff altogether causing mayhem on the rest of the boat (single or double-handed) smile

One of us was always snagging the halyard when it went to the back of the boat. I now have it setup so that the uphaul halyard goes though the spinlock, through a plastic ring on shockcord 80cm from the front beam, through a double exit block under the tramp, through a block on shockcord, through the back of the chute to the spin. The block under the tramp attatched to shock cord that goes through a pulley on the side of the boat, to another pulley at the rear of the tramp and is tied at the other side of the tramp. This pulls the slack halyard to the side of the boat under the tramp so you wont snare it but the long shockcord lets the halyard pull straight with no friction. With this arrangement if our spin is coming down too fast the crew handling the halyard just needs to move further back on the tramp.


Jeff Southall
Current boats
Nacra 5.8 1703 Animal Scanning Services
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Arrow 1576
Re: Slowing down the spinnaker snuff [Re: waynemarlow] #254232
11/01/12 10:43 PM
11/01/12 10:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
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Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
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One thing you can do is pull all the slack up before you blow the cleat(s). The retrieval line/halyard isn't going anywhere if you have it pulled up tight.

Other than that, pull faster. wink


I'm boatless.
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