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by Banzilla. 07/05/21 11:17 AM
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Re: Increased weight [Re: Karl_Brogger] #254852
11/17/12 05:21 AM
11/17/12 05:21 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 893
W
waynemarlow Offline
old hand
waynemarlow  Offline
old hand
W

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 893
Guys do not get me wrong in advocating weight for weight sake, I am a real light weight advocate ( my own home built "almost" F16 compatible boat is around the 100 kilos and I could have made it lighter if I felt the need ( 5 kgs max of ballast ) ) and do consider the likes of the Viper just an economic but lazy way to build boats. I'm sure if the Viper used properly designed ancillary components then it would be pretty close to the class weight, after all I am led to believe the hulls are around the 26 kilos, which is pretty par to most other manufacturers hulls.

But I am a realist who understands that to move foward you sometimes have to bow to greater influences. At this time the rating systems and market forces are out of kilter with our class weights, to change that will take years and years to both alter the perception of the buying public and even longer to sway the likes of the SCHRS who by very nature of its business will be cautious and will generally lag current boat design, after all its not until there is a problem, can it react.

So on one hand I would say why bother at this stage to alter what is a pretty achievible weight and on the other I'm saying for the benefit of the class it is probably a need to accept that we may need for the moment to increase it.

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Re: Increased weight [Re: waynemarlow] #254856
11/17/12 07:16 AM
11/17/12 07:16 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline

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Rolf_Nilsen  Offline

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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Wayne,

I dont see any significant reason to increase min weight and I dont see a need.
Raising min weight would be a very radical move back into the past.

You have presented some valid arguments for taking action and I think this have been an interesting discussion. But it is very clear, to me at least, that nothing needs to be done smile

If there is an agenda in the background to raise min weight we will know when the ballot is presented. It looks like I will have a boat next summer so I will be a class member again. I have not weighted my homebuild yet but whatever the finished weight will be I will not argue to have the class rules changed to optimize my boat laugh


Could we instead talk about CNC and stepper motors not moving as I want them to?

Re: Increased weight [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #254857
11/17/12 08:18 AM
11/17/12 08:18 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 893
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waynemarlow Offline
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waynemarlow  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 893
Guys I might have to eat my words a bit, as part of Bitsa's " upgrade " I have it back at home and felt with all the weight issues being bandied about again, I would take the time to weigh it accurately ( I had only ever weighed it with rig and everything up fresh out of the workshop and its not the easiest at that stage ). Recently I have altered the original spinny concept and had a few ding repairs over the last season + had a water leak etc, probably a more representative time to do the weighing.

A porky 107 kgs or there abouts. I'm pretty sure I could have built it down to around the 104 pretty easily but always knew that weight was not an issue due to the majority of handicap racing that I do ( which I suspect most clubmen do ) and taken some liberties in beefing up the bottom of the hulls with extra layers of glass etc.

Re: Increased weight [Re: Karl_Brogger] #254861
11/17/12 10:13 AM
11/17/12 10:13 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 141
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mini Offline
member
mini  Offline
member
M

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 141
Originally Posted by Karl_Brogger
Mini sounds borderline hostile towards the heavier boats. lol



Sorry, no hostility intended against the heavier boats. They elected to do things a certain way and that is fine with me. The people who purchased their boats did so knowing they were heavy. It is called freedom and I am all over it.

Now there is a movement in place to force heavy on everyone and this does make me hostile. There are affordable choices of lighter boats, so to say it cannot be done is BS. If no one buys the heavy models you better beleive a new light version will soon appear. (From the builders standpoint, why go the effort to do it if the public buys the one you already have). At the end of the day , who cares if Nacra or ahpc or any other builder makes an F16. As long as there are boats being bought, somebody will build them. If the class continues its growth, they already have an investment and they will figure it out - it is not that difficult.

This carbon cost thing is nothing more than scare tactics. I can go out and purchase a new full carbon 75kg state of the art A class cat for the same or less than a Fiberglass and aluminum heavy butt F18. If you ask me, (and I'm getting old, so its more important) the A class option is a much better value for what I am purchasing.

Re: Increased weight [Re: mikekrantz] #254867
11/17/12 02:38 PM
11/17/12 02:38 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
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David Ingram  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
Originally Posted by mikekrantz
Ding, What the hell are you doing over here? Have you been in the koolaid again?


I felt disturbance in the force and I kept getting drawn here and then there it was screaming at me, I couldn't stop myself.

Uh oh, sweetness just caught looking at the F16 forum gotta go.




David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: Increased weight [Re: David Ingram] #254975
11/19/12 04:14 PM
11/19/12 04:14 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
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waterbug_wpb  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Isn't she on an H-16 now?


Jay

Re: Increased weight [Re: waterbug_wpb] #255091
11/21/12 09:40 AM
11/21/12 09:40 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
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David Ingram  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
Isn't she on an H-16 now?


Nope. She is sailing with me this weekend at DIYC and she's doing Hirams. She doesn't mind the H16 but I have ruined her for everyone else. What can I say, I'm special.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: Increased weight [Re: David Ingram] #255092
11/21/12 09:59 AM
11/21/12 09:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
waterbug_wpb  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Like "Short Bus riding" special?


Jay

Re: Increased weight [Re: pgp] #258487
03/22/13 11:47 AM
03/22/13 11:47 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,048
Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
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Timbo  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,048
Sebring, Florida.
The two food supplements I've been using since high school, to both gain weight and increase cerebral capacity are; Pizza and Beer.

The Pizza will put weight on you quickly. If on Friday night you find out it's going to be blowing on Saturday, Eat UP! You'll be 10lbs. heavier by morning!

And the beer will make you super intelligent, even quicker!

Just ask anyone, after their 5th beer...

But be careful, too much beer and you'll lose your Pizza weight!


Blade F16
#777
Re: Increased weight [Re: pgp] #258488
03/22/13 11:50 AM
03/22/13 11:50 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
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Karl_Brogger  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
I'm so glad you're a pilot....


I'm boatless.
Re: Increased weight [Re: pgp] #258489
03/22/13 12:13 PM
03/22/13 12:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
pgp Offline OP
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pgp  Offline OP
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Just watched "Flight". I may never fly again.


Pete Pollard
Blade 702

'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: Increased weight [Re: pgp] #258490
03/22/13 12:51 PM
03/22/13 12:51 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,246
Orlando, FL
tback Offline
veteran
tback  Offline
veteran

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,246
Orlando, FL
Originally Posted by pgp
Just watched "Flight". I may never fly again.


Pete, you're looking at this all wrong.

These men & women pilots are PROFESSIONALS (see Timbo's post above); as such, they can fly in all conditions (weather & personal).

I fully support our professional pilots!!



USA 777
Re: Increased weight [Re: pgp] #258491
03/22/13 01:15 PM
03/22/13 01:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
pgp Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
pgp  Offline OP
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
If you guys knew how many people are in AA, and how many should be, you'd freak!

...yes, been there done that.


Pete Pollard
Blade 702

'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: Increased weight [Re: tback] #258498
03/22/13 03:02 PM
03/22/13 03:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
waterbug_wpb  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Originally Posted by tback
I fully support our professional pilots!!


as Timbo and Orsen Wells pointed out, we'll all be ferried around by drone aircraft pretty soon.

So we can use our support toward single moms...and pole dancing lessons.

Matt can explain how the "good" ones can slide UP the pole


Jay

Re: Increased weight [Re: Karl_Brogger] #258511
03/23/13 07:56 AM
03/23/13 07:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,048
Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
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Timbo  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,048
Sebring, Florida.
Originally Posted by Karl_Brogger
I'm so glad you're a pilot....


I thought we were talking about sailing, not flying.

But if you would like to talk about flying, and share your valuable input, and all your experience, with real pilots, here's where you need to be:

http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com


Blade F16
#777
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