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2021 Rags To Riches Regatta
by John Farris. 05/20/21 05:06 PM
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Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #247165
04/18/12 06:07 PM
04/18/12 06:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
Kris, as a courtesy should you not find a ride for the event, I would be happy to host you at my home and make sure you're on the VIP spectator boat. My way of building goodwill between the F18 and F16 classes.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Rules changes [Re: Kris Hathaway] #247171
04/18/12 08:27 PM
04/18/12 08:27 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 115
F
F18arg Offline
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Posts: 115
Kris

We are in a transition phase, but you need to separate politics and racing in the F18.

The US F18 fleet is doing a great job with a growing fleet, from the south we already have crews attending past NAs. And now expect several more from other countries too, we are building a great continental fleet and LA Worlds will be a milestone event for the class.

As the guys are saying, just get on any F18 and race with us, let the (sometimes) necessary bs to others, the 99% of the F18 sailors just focus on racing and having fun.

On the political bs some of us need to get involved, and when generations change, you have some normal process with occasional fights. Some like me go 'kamikaze' and others work in the background, but all aiming to get more sailors onboard beyond whichever opposite position we may have.

The class is growing fast world wide beyond any paint discussion. So forget about it as a factor for joining.
Get on board, chances are that many F18 sailors will start sailing F16 too in the future due to Olympics?

Cheers,
Martin

Re: Rules changes [Re: ksurfer2] #247172
04/18/12 08:39 PM
04/18/12 08:39 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Karl_Brogger  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Every time you click on this thread, god kills a kitten.


I'm boatless.
Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #247175
04/18/12 09:31 PM
04/18/12 09:31 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
Good. I'm hungry.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Rules changes [Re: Karl_Brogger] #247191
04/19/12 05:17 AM
04/19/12 05:17 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 115
F
F18arg Offline
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F18arg  Offline
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Posts: 115
Well, you may be right, but sometimes the Gods requires some sacrifices to fulfill our petitions.

Re: Rules changes [Re: Karl_Brogger] #247195
04/19/12 07:14 AM
04/19/12 07:14 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,152
tampa, fl
K
ksurfer2 Offline
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K

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Posts: 1,152
tampa, fl
Originally Posted by Karl_Brogger
Every time you click on this thread, god kills a kitten.


Kitten.....the other white meat!


If your havin girl problems i feel bad for you son
I got 99 problems but my beautiful wife ain't one
Re: Rules changes [Re: ksurfer2] #247203
04/19/12 09:30 AM
04/19/12 09:30 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 606
Maryland
Kris Hathaway Offline
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Kris Hathaway  Offline
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Posts: 606
Maryland
Very generous offers (except for the kitten pate) and thank you all. Hopefully by this time next month, I'll know if my transfer is approved and I'll be able to set my calendar and budget for the rest of the season.

I am very aware of the politics vs the sailing. It happens in all fleets, classes, yatch clubs, and even national and global authorities.

BTW, have to share that my first new modern beach cat was a Nacra F18 (2003).


Kris Hathaway
Re: Rules changes [Re: Kris Hathaway] #247250
04/20/12 02:37 AM
04/20/12 02:37 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
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franck Offline
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Originally Posted by Kris Hathaway
I may be incorrect because of a language gap but it sounds like Franck is saying that the NCA's vote does NOT automatically make paint legal. Further, I intrepret Franck's response is that paint has been deemed illegal and until there is a formal petition/proposal that includes an extended waiting/phase-in time if approved, paint continues to be illegal.


Kris
....considering an F18



Very correct Kris, sorry for the language gap. The vote was only a poll: "do we wish... ?", no rule have been changed .


Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #247251
04/20/12 03:55 AM
04/20/12 03:55 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
macca Offline
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macca  Offline
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Australia
Franck, The class president has asked the NCA's a question and they have responded. The results are clear.

The voting process is more in line with the class constitution than the last World council meeting that had decisions made without many NCA's being offered the chance to vote.

This time all NCA's have been consulted and the results are as I posted.


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Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #247269
04/20/12 11:44 AM
04/20/12 11:44 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 172
Anacortes
Sloansailing Offline OP
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Sloansailing  Offline OP
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Anacortes
SHOOOOOOOOTTT MEEEEEEE PLEEEAAAAAAASSEEEEE!

Dead kitten...


Anacortes Rigging.com
Rigging and Yacht Services
Re: Rules changes [Re: macca] #247301
04/21/12 07:03 AM
04/21/12 07:03 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
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franck Offline
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Originally Posted by macca
Franck, The class president has asked the NCA's a question and they have responded. The results are clear.

The voting process is more in line with the class constitution than the last World council meeting that had decisions made without many NCA's being offered the chance to vote.

This time all NCA's have been consulted and the results are as I posted.


Andrew, your presentation of the facts is now correct enough, thanks for the change.

Your commentary about class constitution, is no more than a commentary under your responsability. The facts shows you were wrong about the class, there is no fight except the one you're leading for your business.

And for the moment everyone (may you have it already) is waiting for a proposal which has to be voted and then on year delay notice to be in application.

oooops I've just seen a dead kitten. Stop that please, it's awful grin

Re: Rules changes [Re: Kris Hathaway] #247453
04/25/12 02:27 PM
04/25/12 02:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Originally Posted by Kris Hathaway
Very generous offers (except for the kitten )


what, you have something against chinese food?


Jay

Re: Rules changes [Re: Gav F18] #255665
12/11/12 12:46 PM
12/11/12 12:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
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franck Offline
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Posts: 108
Originally Posted by Gav F18


You haven't answered the question Franck.

- Please prove to me there is a performance advantage in painted vs gelcoated hulls.




Hi, never too late, Alex U. said that (proving enough ??) recently on a commercial website:


"- And the famous paint...
The gelcoat doesn´t makes the boat stronger, is dead weight, so we decided to use paint and reinforce the laminate schedule giving us a better use of the class rules in the benefit of the final sailor that will receive a more stiffer and stronger boat."






Re: Rules changes [Re: franck] #255720
12/15/12 07:23 AM
12/15/12 07:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 36
G
Gav F18 Offline
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Gav F18  Offline
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Posts: 36
Are you serious? You're going to bring this back up. You're like a zombie out of Return of the Living Dead.....but instead of looking for brains you're looking for sh_t to stir.

I read the interview as well and it was very good. There's many builders in the F18 class and they all, rightfully, need to make a commercial return on their investment into the class.

Alex's comments DO NOT indicate that paint is faster than gelcoat. Merely that it gives them an opportunity to lay up a boat differently to make it faster. And what's wrong with that?? The commercial builders working out of Asia use gelcoat to gain a price advantage. Builders like Alex and Windrush don't have that opportunity so use paint instead.

Everyone's a winner....except in your world. Which is somewhere over near Laser Class land. Get over it and move on.

Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #255768
12/17/12 01:56 PM
12/17/12 01:56 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
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franck Offline
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franck  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
I just answer your question. You can now understand or prefer not to read. Your choice.

Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #255780
12/18/12 01:43 PM
12/18/12 01:43 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
macca Offline
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macca  Offline
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Posts: 1,021
Australia
Franck, You are a classic **** stirrer. But you neglect to take note that nobody actually gives a **** about your relentless ranting.

You have an opinion about some rules, and the class has voted on those issues and it was not in line with your opinion.

Now is the time for you to accept that the members have spoken and the rest of us have moved on. You may not agree with it, but you still have to accept the will of the majority.

If you can't deal with that then I suggest you go and play in some other area, perhaps chess or bridge club...


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Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #255782
12/18/12 02:29 PM
12/18/12 02:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
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franck Offline
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franck  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
Hi Macca, hope your fine with GC32, see you move outside F18. That's great.
For information during 2011 december world council 74% of people vote for clarification and against paint and your interpretation, then your failed ISAF action which confirmed no paint for F18.
Surprise, the F18 chairman decide then to accept paint.
Not very democratic, but let's go for it.
Obviously there will be a restricted list, that is the vote I did last week in France.
By the way, how we can check the kind of paint, I don't know ?
Next year you can try to sell F18 with foil. That's your work.
May be my team will sail ont it
But I think it is funny to point out contradictions.
Have fun.

PS: I'm not sure that paint (or curved daggerboard) is good for F18, and F18 business.
Will see the figure of 2012 very soon I guess.

Last edited by franck; 12/18/12 03:00 PM.
Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #255784
12/18/12 02:40 PM
12/18/12 02:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
macca Offline
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macca  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
Dude, for the last time!!!

There was a vote by the council members specifically on the paint issue and guess what??? they voted very clearly to continue to allow paint. This a fact, its not up for debate, and you can see it in the meeting minutes as well as in the ISAF class rules!! I'm not sure what meetings you were at!

And you will be disappointed to know that there is no paint list as you requested, the council wisely decided against that too. So again you miss out on making another stupid rule for the class.

Oh, and Dont worry, I'm still very much in the F18 class. You can see me sailing next season in my painted Phantom with 1.5mil sails that you and your muppet mates failed to ban last week too.

Seriously, look into chess or some other extreme sport more suited to your particular personality type..


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Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #255788
12/18/12 03:16 PM
12/18/12 03:16 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
F
franck Offline
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franck  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 108
December 2011, I was there, just check the minutes.

I just tell about last december 2012 french poll.

How can you explain, you've got the 2012 december minutes to say there is no paint list ? That is not very regular, isnt it ?

Just kiddin, It's your life and your particular personality type. Hope you'll be performing on the water.

Wait for the 2012 F18 figures to appreciate how many F18 have been bought in the world to appreciate paint effect on the fleet.

I mean the fleet of the ordinary guy who paid their F18.








Re: Rules changes [Re: Sloansailing] #255794
12/18/12 11:40 PM
12/18/12 11:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
macca Offline
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macca  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
Enjoy your Christmas.


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