Hi Mark,
When the trial happened it really was between the Viper and the 17.......none of the other boats really came close to those two in terms of selection to fit the ISAF/IOC criteria......interestingly I had a long chat with one of the GB squad sailors who also happens to be part of the family who sell the Viper in the UK and he has a clear opinion that the the 17 was the right choice! (and he had previously been in the GB squad on the T prior to it being dropped from the Olympics!)....as for the 17 not being tested and its initial rig issues, we could say the same about the 49er......would you want the 49er dropped from the Olympics now......there is possibly an argument for t foil rudders although there is also a strong argument not to tame the 17 with the addition of the t foil rudders!.....why do the boards need to be moved???.......

Press photos of 17 wheelies isn't a strong argument to change things otherwise pitch poling 49ers and all those broaching monos should have been removed from international competition a long time ago.......

I agree that the selection came down to a Viper and the N17. They had different strengths and weakness per the ISAF specs. The choice was clearly for a bigger boat and ISAF accepted the risk that the boat was not quite done. The technical committee failed to get the job completed.

So you note.... Taming the N17 with T foils and suggest that choosing not to do so is reasonable... I think that it is as unreasonable as telling the A class sailors to just man up and not put T foils on their C foiled DNA's... just because the pitch pole factor is more challenging. YMMV.

Why move the boards.... because all of the A class designers do what Melvin did and put the boards where the math tells them to... then a year later... they move them forward. So... its just a hunch. YMMV.

So, the 49ner team did extensive changes in the first two years to get the boat basically right.... Nacra was forced to redesign the rig and they did that after the breakages.... For some reason... they did not refine the boat in the same manner and to the same degree as the 49ner... That is my point... it is half baked... I don't know... maybe the politics of it all made them stop refining the boat... ISAF gave them a year to get it working and ... by definition... it was done after a year. The ISAF technical committee had a lot riding on the wisdom of picking this design and their judgement that this was the right design and they believed Melvin's mumbo jumbo... ... ERGO... the world nods their head....the boat is right after a year... I am the kid yelling.. hey mom... the emperor has no clothes... To me it looks pretty silly and lame for the boat to be jumping out of the water after the best in the world have sailed it for two years.

In choosing a SMOD boat that was unproven... the onus was on the ISAF and NACRA to get it right...

Time will tell... if the boat stays the same for the next quad... You guys were right... and I will acknowledge the error in my judgment... If they change it... The question should be... what the hell took so long and who is accountable.

I think Nacra will insist on changes because you probably have a hard time selling this kind of boat to the public high performance market... For reference, look at the F18HT class... Indeed it is a challenging boat to keep the pointy end up in a breeze... You could also say... the boat has bad to terrible manners. YMMV... nevertheless... challenging to sail does not make it appropriate for the Olympics.

Accountable?

I'm sorry, did I miss something here? Did someone die while sailing the N17? No? I didn't think so.

Accountable for what? Delivering a boat that all the sailors love, delivering a boat that is going to have great watchability on the olympic stage?

What axe are you grinding here Mark? Your usual nonsensical pontifications have some basis in legitimate criticism but this one seems to be "I don't like these pictures!"

Tornado > N17

*yawn*

I don't think they could change much this far into the cycle, probably when the next Olympics come up there will be mods on the boat. As for the Tornado going and mixed teams coming in it's worth reminding everyone that was the blindside by the US 2 votes and NZ 1 vote, Olympic reps they said they were voting for cats and voted it out. Now I'm just glad we're back in the Olympics

Why should I care whether this is fast or not?

Sail the boat before giving unsupported statements that the boat is half baked--dodn't repeat your arguments- sail it-sail it first- [or talk to someone who did [btw I did and it is the most exciting boat I've sailed... ever...]

Change the f'n record already. News Flash!!! You're never going to get out from behind the keyboard anyway and start training for the Olympics, so you shouldn't worry yourself with the new boat. Now go get yourself a new crossword puzzle book and get back to some real excitement.

Mark, I hope that you never - ever fly your hull above 300mm

.....because that's not fast and you shouldn't be out sailing if you do it

Ha look at my Avitar, that wasn't fast either

Maybe he secretly loves the boat and mixed discipline, and is just trying to see how much support they actually have?

Mike

That would be a Schneider move.

How many pitchpole photos do you see at big "regular beachcat" regattas?

That would be a good theoretical discussion on the size/scope/buying power of said "high performance market". I suspect many platforms might be hard to sell - foiling moth, 49er, FP.

Reasons may include the learning curve, entry cost, maintenance cost, small fleet size..

But perhaps this market segment (high performance) doesn't worry about those items that keep the platform out of the "public" realm?

+1 A quintessential devil's advocate. So much so, sometimes it's not even on purpose.

I'm new here, so please excuse my ignorance. Is this the half baked, poor performing boat we are talking about?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pAxamg7DY0&index=23&list=PLlSeaiLpRdgyk60vMFNQYenmXjzksQeRy

If so, I will take one if someone is looking to get rid of theirs This video is sick, and I am amazed how they are handling that boat in the swells. It seems to pop off, land perfectly flat and effortlessly.

+1

+2

they do make it look easy, don't they?