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NACRA 500 Spi Halyard Fouls on Jib Furler
by '81 Hobie 16 Lac Leman. 11/11/22 12:11 PM
Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib
by '81 Hobie 16 Lac Leman. 11/11/22 11:50 AM
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Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib #273662
07/03/14 03:17 AM
07/03/14 03:17 AM
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DennisMe Offline OP
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Hi all, for years I've been planning to set up a spinnaker on my 5.2 and yesterday was the first test sail.
Everything was pretty much in the ball park and works reasonably well. It sure saved my a$$ when the wind almost died last night! Paddling five miles is not my idea of fun...
I now have a lot of tweaking to do, which I am really looking forward to.

Just one thing was a PITA, I hoisted the spin and rolled the jib in order to get a better overview of the set of the sail. Then I noticed the spinnaker halyard got fouled around the furling jib. I quickly unfurled the jib again while I still had enough leeway to douse the spin and everything was OK from then on. But; no furling... Because I sail solo most of the time I'd really like to get it to co-operate with the spin.

I have that huge original overlapping Jib with nasty leech battens. I guess I'll have to alter those asap.

I was wondering though, What solutions have you come up with?
I could re-cut the jib, that would remove the need for leech battens and make for a tighter package when furled. I eyeballed it and it looks like it would cost me 30% of the surface area if I move the sheeting point to the front beam. That's pretty scary but would have the added bonus of clearing up the tramp. Would that do the trick though? I'd hate to go through with a major re-cut and find out it makes no significant difference.

Thanks,
Dennis

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Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273666
07/03/14 05:47 AM
07/03/14 05:47 AM
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Jake Offline
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You can have an overlapping jib on a roller furler. Normally the battens will be rotated on the sail so they are parallel to the luff (they get a bit longer too - usually). This way they are parallel to the furling action and will roll up with the sail.

With regards to it catching on the spinnaker halyard - it takes a little effort to either furl after the spinnaker is up (and has some air in it) or make sure the spinnaker halyard is somewhat taught before you start to furl the jib. Furling jib with a spinnaker is a pretty common setup...it just takes some additional process to make sure everything works reliably.


Jake Kohl
Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273668
07/03/14 06:41 AM
07/03/14 06:41 AM
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Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
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OR...leave the jib out too, with the spinnaker up. Unless it's really blowing, more is better.

If the jib being out is interfering with the airflow to the spin (or vice-versa) maybe your spin pole needs to be longer?


Blade F16
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Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273669
07/03/14 06:46 AM
07/03/14 06:46 AM
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Get a smaller jib and a selftacker?
Or tension the spin halyard before furling the jib?

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273672
07/03/14 07:08 AM
07/03/14 07:08 AM
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DennisMe Offline OP
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Hmm, ok. I tried tensioning the halyard but the battens will catch anyway. Looks like the first thing to try will be to angle the battens so they 'just roll with it' so to speak.

Of course, furling it with the spin up should be easy. I didn't have the guts to try that yesterday but I think it should work. The return part of the halyard seems to be ok, but I could run it inside the spreaders to keep it out of harm's way. I'll try that out as soon as I get the chance.

A self tacker sounds expensive so I'm not too keen on that. OTOH, maybe re-cutting the jib and sheeting from the front beam is do-able. I'd have to get over all that surface area I'll lose though...

The spin pole is as designed for this spinnaker and forward sheeting, lengthening it would stress the lower leach (and its a PITA). The spin didn't seem to interfere much with the sails except having to trim them in 20-30 degrees or so with the increase in apparent wind. I'm quite satisfied with the set up except for the furler hassles.

Last edited by DennisMe; 07/03/14 07:14 AM.
Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273673
07/03/14 08:06 AM
07/03/14 08:06 AM
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tshan Offline
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Do you need the jib battens? I mean, REALLY need them?


Tom
Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: tshan] #273674
07/03/14 08:23 AM
07/03/14 08:23 AM
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DennisMe Offline OP
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I dunno. I never tried sailing without battens. Not on this boat that is. I guess they'd come in handy when its really blowing and you want to de-power the jib. In that case I'd normally furl it anyway.
Gotta try that asap too!

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: tshan] #273676
07/03/14 08:35 AM
07/03/14 08:35 AM
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Jake Offline
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Originally Posted by tshan
Do you need the jib battens? I mean, REALLY need them?


yes...it will probably start "motorboating" without them


Jake Kohl
Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273679
07/03/14 12:41 PM
07/03/14 12:41 PM
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Columbia South Carolina, USA
dave mosley Offline
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I sailed a 5.2 along time,looking back I know for a fact that you do not need that much jib. Also, run the jib sheets to the front beam and lose those annoying cables thru the tramp and the antiquated barber hauler system if you have it.
I would seriously look for a a small F18 jib and try it for size, the standard F18 jib may work as well.
This will make your sailing much more pleasureable!


The men were amazed, and said, "What kind of a man is this, that even the winds and the sea obey Him?" Matthew 8:27





Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273681
07/03/14 01:25 PM
07/03/14 01:25 PM
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Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
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And if you are going to be doing a lot of single handed sailing, the self tacker is worth it's weight in gold!


Blade F16
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Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: Timbo] #273683
07/03/14 03:40 PM
07/03/14 03:40 PM
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NACRA 5.2 talk is tempting to share in... having sailed #98 with such owners as Chris Christensen, Dirk & Eric Lundquist, Jim Leonard, Mike Mead, and my good buddy, Larry Shannon.

We had a dealership in Pensacola that made a very early buy from NACRA and the Roland brothers. During our watch we modified the trampoline so the jib leads ran under the trampoline to the front beam, proved the rake spreader was faster, and finally pioneered the double trap system which was approved by the Class shortly after the NAMSA NAs in Treasure Island (circa 1976 0r 7).

The boat was under - powered to begin with and performance in heavy air stamped that as truth. One can go to a beam mounted jib or self tacking system, but the boat would even lose more point and lose reaching power. Ya can not make the short rig faster with a smaller jib on a 5.2. Depending on the hull number, the hulls are overweight and overweight X, and XL in kilos or pounds. That is original cardboard hull stringers, foam layup by NACRA, or foam laminate by Frank Butler/Catalina Yachts.

Singlehanding the boat sans jib was a hoot, but the boat was really difficult to tack in a sea state. I would want a small jib, a bridal foil (5.5 or 5.8 style) to secure the pole under for stiffness and prevent the bows to be pinched. Break down and go for a self tacking system off an F 16, have your jib recut, deep six the furler, and fly boldly, fly.

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273687
07/03/14 07:09 PM
07/03/14 07:09 PM
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tshan Offline
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Good ol' US98. Was that actual hull #98? I always assumed you carried that number because US Highway 98 on the gulf coast.


Tom
Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273699
07/04/14 02:25 AM
07/04/14 02:25 AM
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DennisMe Offline OP
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I have this Jib lying around I've never tried. A while ago I bought the set (Square-top main and matching Jib) off a "Trigger Catamaran", a butt ugly (IMHO) Dutch designed cat from a company that went bust some years ago.

I re-cut the Square top for my 5.2 and it is a real blast but I never got around to doing the Jib. Looks like the time is right about now... I'll see how it wants to be sheeted and if I can slice and splice it down the middle to get the sheeting points onto the main beam.

My 5.2 is solid glass. It has cardboard stringers and is indeed very heavy! In fact, its built like a tank and can take quite a beating, rocks, concrete pavement, you name it!

I'll skip the bridle foil for now because I'm only carrying a small spin, 15.3 m^2. (165 sq ft). I reinforced the hulls a couple of seasons back and repaired the torn out push-rods between the bow sides.

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273703
07/04/14 06:15 AM
07/04/14 06:15 AM
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Columbia South Carolina, USA
dave mosley Offline
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you may be able to find a trashed newer boat to recover a self tacker from, ask around.
My 5.2 was a 1976, forgot the sail number, but it now sails from my club newly refurbished(again) with a Sq top. Boat is heavy but well built. I redid the bottoms twice and they have been again now, but other than that its a tank. original mast, daggers, and rudders, I traded for the boat in 1990 after sailing a G-Cat 5.0. traded my laser 2 for it straight up, been a catsailor ever since.


The men were amazed, and said, "What kind of a man is this, that even the winds and the sea obey Him?" Matthew 8:27





Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: tshan] #273709
07/04/14 09:12 AM
07/04/14 09:12 AM
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Happy Fourth, Tom. I miss those days at Mil & Larry's, especially on the 4th or Blue Angel weekends. Give Mil my best.

Yes, I chose that hull No# because of HWY 98. My 2001 boat was an honor to Arthur C. Clarke, and following 9/11 Bert and I went to 2010, for the tri, Clarke's second novel in that genre.

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273920
07/15/14 11:09 AM
07/15/14 11:09 AM
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DennisMe Offline OP
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Here's an update for you folks.

I re-cut my spare (non fitting) jib to sheet from the main beam and installed "vertical battens" in it to tame the deadly leech curl I got without any battens.

This allowed me to remove the wires that ran across the tramp and re-use the existing sheet blocks and clamps. It should also allow me to furl the jib properly. I also re-routed the continuous halyard tensioner to keep the halyard tight when the spin is doused.

I have yet to go sailing with the boat in this configuration but I expect to know more by the end of this weekend. I'll keep you posted.

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273926
07/15/14 05:03 PM
07/15/14 05:03 PM

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MN3
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MN3
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Originally Posted by DennisMe
I also re-routed the continuous halyard tensioner to keep the halyard tight when the spin is doused


continuous halyard tensioner ? huh? what is this device?

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: ] #273936
07/15/14 08:06 PM
07/15/14 08:06 PM
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Jake Offline
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Originally Posted by MN3
Originally Posted by DennisMe
I also re-routed the continuous halyard tensioner to keep the halyard tight when the spin is doused


continuous halyard tensioner ? huh? what is this device?


It can be rigged several different ways. Our is rigged on a double ended bunji to our tack line. The ends of the bunji turn around blocks and/or rings near the front beam and come through grommets at the back of the trampoline where they terminate in large plastic rings. The halyard goes through both of these rings in addition to it's normal routing. This way, when the spinnaker is snuffed and the tack line is extended through the pole into the snuffer bag, the bunji is pulled tight and the halyard is neatly pulled and spread out toward the rear beam. Once the tack line is pulled and the tack of the spinnaker makes it to the end of the pole, the new slack in the tack line loosens the bunji and allows the halyard more room to do it's thing.


Jake Kohl
Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: DennisMe] #273942
07/16/14 03:33 AM
07/16/14 03:33 AM
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Also, run the Aion Kinah jib sheets to the front beam and lose those annoying cables thru the tramp and the antiquated barber hauler system if you have it.

Re: Spinnaker on Nacra 5.2; halyard fouls when (un)furling jib [Re: luojie] #273945
07/16/14 05:47 AM
07/16/14 05:47 AM
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Jake Offline
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Originally Posted by luojie
Also, run the Aion Kinah jib sheets to the front beam and lose those annoying cables thru the tramp and the antiquated barber hauler system if you have it.


DON'T CLICK...SPAMMER. lord only knows what's at the other end of that link.


Jake Kohl
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