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Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: rehmbo] #281917
02/15/16 07:46 AM
02/15/16 07:46 AM

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lol
Originally Posted by rehmbo
Clearly I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. Not seeing any N17 sailing... frown

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #281935
02/16/16 09:39 AM
02/16/16 09:39 AM
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brucat Offline
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Interesting that the top ranked US teams coming out of the trials process aren't catsailors (born/raised), but are converts from other disciplines, with cat experience ranging from a few months to several years. Time will tell if they can pull it together and medal, but this turns conventional wisdom around a bit.

Mike

Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #281937
02/16/16 10:48 AM
02/16/16 10:48 AM
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Jeff.Dusek Offline OP
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I don't think it is that surprising. Bora is one of, if not the most, talented apparent wind sailors in the US. Lots of 49er, Melges 24, and Moth experience, plus some time with Luna Rossa. He is a pro, and probably has much more cumulative time on the water than anyone else (aside from maybe Mendelblatt). I really don't think the catamaran aspect is all that important.

Similar things could be side about the Mendelblatts- huge amounts of high level racing experience including two Olympics for Mark. It could be argued that Mark adapted less well to the fast boat after years of Lasers and Stars.

Most of the other teams, and I have huge amounts of respect for all of them, really don't have the experience of those two, and I think ultimately it showed. Mike and Katie got very close, and who knows if the trials had been a few days longer or if Katie's knee was healthy.

Congrats to all who put everything on the line for a chance to represent their country.

Last edited by Jeff.Dusek; 02/16/16 10:50 AM.

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Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #281941
02/16/16 02:22 PM
02/16/16 02:22 PM
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brucat Offline
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Agreed. It's just an interesting development, and goes against what lots of folks here have traditionally thought.

Probably the key difference is coming from fast apparent wind boats (is that redundant?). We tend to cringe when a monohull sailor tries a leebow tack on a cat...

Mike

Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #281944
02/16/16 05:07 PM
02/16/16 05:07 PM
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Annapolis, MD
Mark Schneider Offline
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Jeff, I second your congratulations to all of the players over the cycle.

A bit of history on this catamaran background thing being important... Dean Brenner was the Olympic director when the Tornado was the OPEN olympic boat. Dean's philosophy was based on the same notion that you spoke of... Catamaran experience was irrelevant. What you needed was great sailors who were committed to Olympic competition.... It was a 6 month learning curve to get one of these sailors up to speed on an Olympic class and they would be the best sailor in the class in the US... and then be positioned to move up the ISAF world ranks. Dean used the Johnny can Charlie story as evidence for this philosophy... In his conversation with me... after Randy S retired.... Johnny, Charlie, Lars and 4 or 5 other College All American sailors started in the Tornado Class. The coach em up strategy/ every team for themselves was implemented... Well... it took a bit longer... 8 years and some exclusive technology assistance... and they got a Silver.... but... the next 4 years did not go well and the next technology flyer failed completely and they finished DFL. After Weymouth... The US concluded that the coach em up strategy was a failure...

Josh Adams was tasked with building something that looked more like the rest of the worlds. The plan would take at least 8 years... BUT... The hope for the 2016 quad for the US was that New Classes (N17S AND Womans FX) historically favored the US because we could get up to speed sooner then the world.

I look at these results as strong evidence that the coach em up strategy IS a total failure.

The Mendelblatts ARE Olympic Caliber Sailors, who know how to campaign...and use coaching.... Bottom line.. 4 years training... usual finish in the 20s. I would conclude that coaching up an olympic level displacement sailor takes... at least 8 years... just like it took Johnny and Charlie, Lars etc.

Gulliari is a another successful world class sailor... but with lots of apparent wind experience... So... in the two years of his coach em up experience... he manages a thirty something finish and backs into the slot. Moreover, he declares that there is a lot for him to learn with 5 months to go.... ... I conclude that even taking a world class apparent wind sailor and trying the coach em up approach is a failure.

Final point on the failure of the coach em up approach.. is Bundy's experience in the 49ner... When the T and Open was dropped... Bundy tried to switch to the 49ner for AUS and it was a failure.
The coach em up approach just doesn't work!

Now... the rest of the world.. shows us that training EARLY in catamarans is a key to being able to win on the world stage..that seems to be the backgound of a lot of the top 10 teams. (Hell Waterhouse and Phipps are spawn of ELITE cat sailor).

My take home... Those of us in the rank and file simply have to reach out and get top junior racers in our regions some early exposure to catamaran racing.. Mentor them as they cross train in cats while dinking around in 420s in college and HOPE that US Sailing can hire some great coaches. Not the same as the rest of the world... but it may be our only option.

So.... ask me about running a TRY IT OUT clinic in your area... We will see if we can make this American hybrid solution work!





crac.sailregattas.com
Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #282313
03/29/16 02:31 PM
03/29/16 02:31 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 381
SE MI / NE IN
rehmbo Offline
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Looks like some improvement for team Gulari/Chafee

http://www.trofeoprincesasofia.org/en/default/races/race-resultsall

[Linked Image]


Jeff R

H18, C2 USA1193
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Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #282322
03/30/16 06:55 AM
03/30/16 06:55 AM
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brucat Offline
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Nice!

Mike

Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: rehmbo] #282323
03/30/16 07:49 AM
03/30/16 07:49 AM
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Word on the street is that Randy Smyth has been coaching them ...

Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #282329
03/31/16 05:34 PM
03/31/16 05:34 PM
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brucat Offline
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After 12 races, hanging in 14th place. They've been consistently inconsistent, but staying in the top half.

Besson is unstoppable again.

Mike

Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #282332
04/01/16 02:16 PM
04/01/16 02:16 PM
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Eastern NC, USA
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tshan Offline
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Bullet in race #15. Wow.


Tom
Re: USA gets a Nacra 17 slot for RIO!! [Re: Jeff.Dusek] #282333
04/01/16 04:07 PM
04/01/16 04:07 PM
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brucat Offline
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And a 3 in race 13, up to 12th overall now. Sweet!

Mike

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