| Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287107 06/07/17 06:09 AM 06/07/17 06:09 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | Another point - one very good solid reason why they have one-design wings. Safety. If the wing design had been up to the individual design teams, everyone would have taken the designs to the structural edge with every regard toward speed and lightness. Having the mast stay in one piece during a capsize wouldn't have been in the design criteria. The AC Authority got this aspect completely correct.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287108 06/07/17 07:18 AM 06/07/17 07:18 AM |
Joined: May 2007 Posts: 117 Atlanta, GA KentHobie
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 117 Atlanta, GA | A question about the penalties. I know other team will know when you receive a penalty but do they know when you've been released from it?
Kent 1988 H16
| | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287110 06/07/17 07:43 AM 06/07/17 07:43 AM |
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 6,049 Sebring, Florida. Timbo
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Posts: 6,049 Sebring, Florida. | I was amazed the mast (wing) and the rigging holding it in place held up for the righting, perhaps they did design for that .
Blade F16 #777
| | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287111 06/07/17 08:12 AM 06/07/17 08:12 AM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | Philip, I only call what I see. You said GBR turned back, which to me means, stop racing and sail back to pull bodies from the water (as we mere mortals do every weekend if necessary). I agree that he slowed and looked back, but that's a very different animal.
And just so you don't think I hate Ben for this, I agree that it would have been more dangerous for them to sail back to the crash scene. The power boats are there for that.
For the record, I'll always think that Burling should have retired after the SWE race with the bad umpire call. Yes, in the heat of the moment he panicked and pushed the button, but could have redeemed himself with greater sportsmanship afterwards.
Mike | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: Timbo]
#287112 06/07/17 08:17 AM 06/07/17 08:17 AM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | I was amazed the mast (wing) and the rigging holding it in place held up for the righting, perhaps they did design for that . I wonder if the forces on the wing are greatest while foiling, floating ("displacement mode"), gybing or capsized. The water was pretty flat, and didn't look too uncomfortable to be capsized there. Mike | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: brucat]
#287113 06/07/17 09:04 AM 06/07/17 09:04 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 2,490 On the Water | Philip, I only call what I see. You said GBR turned back, Mike, you missed the narrative and you are nit-picking, and clearly taking words out of context. I stand behind my words. They stopped racing. Fact. They proceeded in their protocol for this safety event. Fact. Listen to this. 2:22 markthen go back and watch the boat's tracks on the virtual eye replay, which clear shows them stopping to assist. So to edit my words to satisfy your delusional interpretation of what everyone else gets, I shall state that "BAR stopped to assist". And let me add, my feelings at the time was that these pros put safety first, that they are a band of brothers, and I found it extremely honorable that BAR immediately stopped racing and went into ASSIST mode. Therefore, WOW !!
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287120 06/07/17 09:20 AM 06/07/17 09:20 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,490 On the Water | Today's races
14:08 Bermuda NZL vs GBR (R5)
14:36 Bermuda SWE vs JPN (R5)
15:06 Bermuda GBR vs NZL* (R6)
15:35 Bermuda JPN vs SWE* (R6)
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287121 06/07/17 09:32 AM 06/07/17 09:32 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,490 On the Water | High winds and building. We could see postponements due to upper wind limit.
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287123 06/07/17 11:29 AM 06/07/17 11:29 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,490 On the Water | Under postponement and monitoring wind and sea-state.
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287125 06/07/17 01:08 PM 06/07/17 01:08 PM |
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 6,049 Sebring, Florida. Timbo
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049 Sebring, Florida. | Have they come up with an upper and lower wind limit to start and or abandon a race yet? I haven't heard one mentioned...yet, but after yesterday's wipeout they might come up with one.
Blade F16 #777
| | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287126 06/07/17 01:26 PM 06/07/17 01:26 PM |
Joined: Mar 2009 Posts: 932 Solomon's Island, MD samc99us
old hand
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 932 Solomon's Island, MD | Its all in the rules: https://www.americascup.com/en/news/2583_KNOW-THE-ESSENTIALS-AMERICAS-CUP-RULES-101.html6-24 kts, taken as a 5 minute average between 8 and 3 minutes before the start. I feel for TNZ on this one, but the damage could have been much, much worse. I'm sure they will be back out there tomorrow. The safety of the one design aspect of the boats certainly shone through yesterday, but I still don't entirely agree with this. The one design beams I'm okay with, the one deisgn #1 element on the wing I am sort of okay with, the rest not really. FYI the #2 element (trailing edge flap) and wing controls are not one design and open to interpretation. My understanding is only the structural main element mast is really strictly one design. I think TNZ would have gone with more margin in the hulls rather than relying on Oracles lower volume prescribed hull design, if given the flexibility there. Would it have saved them? No, they were on the foils going down the mine and it was too late by the time the bows hit. If anything a bigger bow section would have hurt. The emphasis on the controls and foils clearly favor Oracle, who have more experience than any other team besides the less well funded TNZ campaign. I understand the AC is never very fair but I preferred the run what you bring and your wallet can swallow over this glorified AC45F racing. Frankly the same level of racing could be had with a box/open rule AC45F. I'm really disappointed Oracle sailed in the initial LV challenger series. I think that was rather unfair and unsportsman like. I'm also not okay with the 1 boat rule for the challengers. That clearly favors Oracle whom I suspect have a second boat in the shed just in case (with the amount of money thrown around, why wouldn't you?). One designing the major structural elements of the boat made it pretty feasible that a second boat could be built on the cheap. This puts Oracle in a position to effectively force races in conditions that are otherwise very hairy and marginal, yesterday wasn't deadly but it was a bit marginal. By the time the challenger gets through to the finals, they will likely have done some damage to their race stead and be operating at a higher weight as a result. Far from ideal if it goes light, but good for Oracle!
Scorpion F18
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