recently posted on the new forum ,--suggestions for improving catamaran racing in N A

Outlined the concept of Formula Classes in each length category to eventually include all catamarans in basic L categories for racing groups .
long winded -sorry

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/sho...ew=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

Expanded Formula 20 would eventually have an HT category
for a future class of lighter weight larger beam 20s
like the Marstom 20 --Ventilo -10 beam --CFR ht types --Tornado --etc forming its basic specs and rules outline.
Ventillo example http://www.morrellimelvin.com/page29.html

Also in the N A F-20- ideally it would eventually also include a non spin 20 sub category ,-kind of like a B fleet in H racing ,-more for newer sailors to get involved in 20 racing that do not want or are not yet ready for a spin or just like racing without one.

One other concept in the total Formula L category theme was much like the current F-14 preliminary rule of having a more open less restricted developmental unlimited class ,--in larger Length category also.
C Class cats have the upper range in development though extremely expencive .
A middle range L that allowed development may be the ideal again .
The only class that existed previously was the 18 sq class
unlimited beam etc etc -with only Length and sail area .
here is an 18 sq post on the new forum with lots of info
http://www.catsailor.com/forums/sho...ew=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

It might be interesting to speculate on a similar or same type unlimited Formula class category ,--maybe per single handed 18 sq rule --or -20 length with spin added as one poster plans to build.

--Might just call it the Formula Unlimited ,20
The Class logo would just have a large
F---U on the sail just joking as usual--

all L Formula Classes will exist eventually -
If there is more real interest in starting a more unlimited development 20 class first ,-I,m all for it .
any interest or ideas out there ?-

Humorous mood today ,
Also here is a new Panda biscuts kinda rap for any Rathergood fans out there ---off sailing topic }
have fun
http://www.rathergood.com/biscuits/

It is difficult being unable to effect current status and existing conditions which are noncondusive to a production boat type F-20 class in N A ,--though iF-20 ongoing in EU .http://www.formula20.org/

The N A version Inter 20 was made instantly popular being the Worrell 1000 boat . Also it was not built to the iF 20 Formula Class rule here for use in NA --The Inter 20 has a 15 sq ft larger mainsail than iF 20 RULES , and has a weight of 390 LB ,--which is 28 Lbs lighter than iF 20.

IT IS FASTER for these reasons and also its CF mast . Mainly I,d say the boat has been refined and raced extensively with improvements to its sails ,-improved spin shapes {3 versions} according to I 20 sailors , new self tacking battened jib of different shape ,-and now new larger more balanced rudders ,-these should help the added mast rake most run which increases balance with spin and has proven much faster downwind ,-though sacrificing some upwind light air speed . The techniques learned by the I-20 sailors to get the most out of them also makes them faster comparibly to other existing production 20s .

Existing conditions -- 1 -There is no builder support for a F-20 , Hobie has it brand only edict , the Fox has proven unpopular ,-The Miracle is the non spin Hobie "only" 20 -
Some H-20s have added a new sq top main and spin snuffer but believe the heavy comp-tip mast and boat weight make it non competitive with the I-20 .
Perf. Cat has the market on 20 racing ,-it has no reason to change its stategy of offering a lighter -larger sail area boat or reason to support a F-20 effort .
Nacra 6/0s are fewer and exist is some pockets geographically ,-most have adopted a larger non factory spin ,but seem "not interested" in anything except 6/0 racing and handicap distance racing .

Other 20 production cat designs have similar existing conditions per heavier design weight ,-less sail area ,--heavier mast, . Proposed rules allow any boat to change or modify to 20 specs. heavier boats are allowed larger spin sail area to compensate .

Existing conditions ,-lack of builder support ,-non interest in local race groups of brand classes ,--Hobie only edicts ,-etc etc . -
It may be best to let these existing production 20s go the way of H-18 s and become non built dead boat brand classes , though do believe there will eventually be a production oriented Formula 20 class and will keep the concept and idea alive until enough 20 owners actively want to join in and run with a NA Formula 20 class for production 20 cat designs,----it may just occur too late.

Other Formula classes are currently attracting previous 20 owners ,-more and more this year .

This however creates other options and opportunities besides going to F-18 or 18ht or 16 ht or open F-14s or AClass cats ,-all good development classes .

Many catsailors like the 20 size ,-
An HT 20 Class with lighter boat weight and larger 10 beam are one option , this HT 20 class started in EU .The Ventillo 20 http://www.morrellimelvin.com/page29.html--10 ft beam ,seemed to DOMINATE it early ,but other good 20 designs are available like the Marstom 20 with a GPS verified 30 knots - http://www.sailcenter.se/administration/Boats/M20/index.asp

It may be best to focus efforts here on a new HT 20 CLASS open to lighter Formula 20s if any are interested .
the existing F-20 HT specs per Ventillo
SPECIFICATIONS

LOA 20' 0" 6.09 M
LWL 19' 11" 6.06 M
BEAM 10' 0" 3.04 M
CONSTRUCTION FRP/FOAM SANDWICH/ CARBON
DRAFT 4' 0" 1.21 M
MAINSAIL 235 SQ. FT. 71.64 M
SPINNAKER 258 SQ. FT. 78.65 M
I 23' 7" 7.1 M
P 35' 0" 10.67
E 8' 2" 2.5 M

here are Marstrom 20 specs
L 6.1 m
W 2.93 m
All up weight 115 kg
mastheight 10.5 m
Sa upw 22 m2
Sa downw 44 m2



The other option currently and development class that should exist again or be returned in updated modern form is the 18 sq .--Since the A Class ,for single handed non spin cats exist in popular form again it may be ideal to target a spin rigged 2 person development class to compliment other ongoing Formula classes and allow the innovative types or home builder this size range to develop design concepts within .

F U or Formula Unlimited class may just set a L and max sail area ,--but open to any design innovation within . unlimited beam ,-unlimited mast L -no min weight , one or more crew ,-etc --just L 20 and sail area at ?
I find myself less interested in production brand class 20s and interested in a Formula clas of some type ,--preferrably HT 20s ,--or more interesting a design build 20 project and class to race within ,-

All 3 sub class 20 categories should eventualy exist as estanblished ISAF racing classes as both F-20 and HT 20S DO NOW .
The Open development F-20 category may be unique to N A .
Any interest or ideas on this option

Where does that leave me/ H-20. flat top and spin? To fend for my self in the open class, race portsmouth and get beat by a Dart built in the early 80's and the Arc 17.....

Lets keep trying Eric ,-there are numerous interested Formula 20 sailors out there spread all over N A and several thousand potential existing similar production 20 ft cats out there as well .

The powers that be are resistant to it though --that is reality .

Nacra inter 20 owns the 20 ft w spin cat market,--they have no reason to support a F-20 ,--though they do support F-18 ---go figure .
Most winners or leaders of small groups of Inter 20s like winning in brand class in their area and do not want change , same with Nacra groups , after spending 15 k on a boat I can,t blame em , they like their brand class group just the way its been for 2 decades,--- WITH decline in the sport with brand only edicts and events .
The small groups that race P handicap like their small group and favorable rating number , and are resistant -
Handicap timed rating PROPONANTS SAY THEY ONLY HAVE 15 BOAT EVENTS .- wonder why most go to H ?
good large class racing ,--only formula will replace it , not handicap racing .
Hobie has a brand only edict - the Fox will not sell for several reasons ,-H people are all supposed to buy a F-18 tiger ,-a Formula 18 imported from EU , yet raced in NA in H ONLY EVENTS ?

We are all just big spoiled kids playing with boats ,-each by their own rules -
but I think the sport should be more than that or be dominated and controlled by brand class edicts or brand class only rule.

Many ,many sailors agree and are purchasing and joining other formula classes --F-14 F-16 f-18 AND f18 HT CLASSES NOW in NA .

people are fed up with brand class edicts and realize this is the future of the sport .

Jon ,the organizer of the Atlantic 1000 stated on the distance race forum that they would like the race to be Formula 18s and Formula 20s in the future when there is a Formula 20 class --
I,m just one sailor ,--how do we get it going .

We need to find inexpensive ways and suppliers to allow sailors to modify their boat to an equal spec and potential speed of the I-20 -and encourage large numbers of 20 sailors to add spin snuffer systems and actively start and seek Formula 20 area classes and events .

THANKS eric ---- F-20 ---it is ALIVE !

Organize under NAMSA....

Just for the record, I am currently on a N6.0 and will likely move to an I20 in another year or two simply because it seems to have the best chance of becoming the standard for F-20. My sincere hope is that more 20 sailors get interested in F20 as I will be far more inclined to travel to F20 races that to Brand-x races. I continue to be bewildered by sailors in America of all places that allow themselves to be told how to enjoy their free time by a single manufacturer regardless of who that manuf is....

JL

I am probably going to go to the I-20 as well. Currently on H-20 w/spin and fat head main. Rating is .611, it's tough to compete in the open class with that rating. I-20 fleet keeps on getting stronger, H-20, not the case.

Hey Carl,
"Expanded Formula 20 would eventually have an HT category
for a future class of lighter weight larger beam 20s
like the Marstom 20 --Ventilo -10 beam --CFR ht types --Tornado --etc forming its basic specs and rules outline."

This year there were two M20s in the Miami to Key Largo Race, two M20s in the Hogsbreath Race and two M20s in the Mug Race. One of these boats was sailed by Mr. Marstrom himself and the other by an excellent sailing team from Miami. I think you would find it interesting to check out the race results on a boat for boat basis and on a corrected time basis.
Bill