I forget : Here is the webpage of the company that is working on getting the Blade F16 build locally in the US :

http://www.vectorworksmarine.com/

I'm not in any doubt that they can build an excellent lightweight laminate catamaran.

Wouter

>>I had checked out the Taipan 4.9 ... but it is just a little over my budget,

True, that is the problem with the Taipan 4.9 at the moment. There is no denying it.

>>after all this will be the first cat that I will actually own. My accountant (that's me ) thinks it will be an option my second time around.

In that case a good secondhander may be the best option you have. Than a nacra 5.0 or nacra 500 comes to mind.


>>I have been researching the I17R but I think the design is a little old. Does anyone know when it was first designed

Somewhere around 1997 in Australia. Than it was taken up by the US Nacra yard and they changed some stuff of which the weight (more) and the general setup. The Australian original was a two person boat with a large overlapping jib and no spi. Nacra US removed the jib and placed a spi on it and made a singlehander and later replaced the alu mast for a longer carbon one and increased the sail area as well. Brobu sails an alu masted I-17 which would be ideal for his conditions were you don't want that much sailarea on a tall mast anyway. THis is the development in a nutt shell


>>How does the price compare to the Taipan 4.9? . Any other words about this cat?

It is alot cheaper than the Taipan on the US market. I hear it is generally a well (very) behaved boat although the alu masted boat is underpowered in the lighter stuff and its handicap rating and performance reflects this. And for you US guys I'm talking about the version sailed in Europe with the alu mast. The Americans sail the I-17R and this one has boosted performance. It has a carbon mast but it is nowhere near the lightweight of an A-cat carbon mast. Generally a good decent boat. And the only one I haven't sailed myself yet, so I trust that my sailing buddies informed me correctly.


>>I haven't much looked at the Blade yet but I will consider it eventhough it seems as though it is more tailored to flat water; there isn't much of that around here on the Atlantic side of the island.


Yeah well, that is what people say before they have to sail against the Blade in the heavy stuff (chop and waves). I think all who (tested) sailed her since launch were quite expressive about her ability to take-one waves and chop. And I mean in positive terms. General comment is that she has a very smooth feel, no matter what the seastate.


>>>Is there a cat that I can right solo?

A-cat
Prindle 15
Hobie 14


I hope this helps

Wouter

Thanks for the info Wouter.

Mark.

I've had my FX-1 out with two and had no problems whatsoever. The boat handles the same, just a slight decrease in the acceleration is all I've noticed. I weigh about 190lbs and have no trouble at all with righting, it comes up in no time. The person I bought it from weighed about 165 lbs and he reported little trouble righting it as well.

While I think being able to right a boat is critical, most boats can be righted with one person. I had a TheMightyHobie18 before the FX-1 and could do it myself as well with an adaptive device. Hooking it up took about 2 minutes, so total time to right was about 5 minutes. Again, righting the boat is critical, but I think more critical is finding the right boat for you. You will spend much more time upright than sideways, so find a boat you like to sail....then figure out a way to make it work. There are plenty of devices out there to help you.

The FX-1 is a really fun boat. I have not sailed an I17, so I cannot compare, but I have a blast on my boat. The acceleration is great, upwind speed is good and once the chute is up......see ya later! I can rig the boat myself with little trouble and it's light enough to move on the beach myself as well.

My wife and I will be racing together later this year and if you wish, I can let you know how it goes. So far this year, I've raced solo and done very well. A lot of the fun for me is figuring out the new boat and dialing it in. If you have any questions, just let me know! Good luck in finding the right boat for you.

Kip
Boise, ID
FX-1

Kip....you wouldnt by chance have any pictures of how your kite is set up....Im looking at a kite for mine this summer...I have had a great time on mine also...goes really well in the caribbean swells...Harper

Well I think I have made up my mind to simply buy a used H16 to start. There doesn't seem to many other types of boats around here and buying a used boat will get me to a new one faster. I think an F16 would be my best choice for my needs when I go new, don't know which one, maybe an American Blade once they are in production. What do you think about my plan?

Wouter, can you or anyone else keep us updated on production of the US Blade?



Thanks everyone for your input, it was extremely valuable. I can see by everyone's freely given and honest opinions that I am about to join a wonderful community of free minded and generous people. The experience that I have had so far on this forum has put my faith back into the human race; there really are nice people out there who are willing to help others and you should really congradulate yourselves for that.

Well I got to get busy shopping the "flea markets" for a used H16. I think I may already have one spied out. I'll let you know how it goes.

Thanks All. See Ya Round

BLS

>>Wouter, can you or anyone else keep us updated on production of the US Blade?

Of course.

>>Well I think I have made up my mind to simply buy a used H16 to start. There doesn't seem to many other types of boats around here and buying a used boat will get me to a new one faster.

I think this to be a very wise decision. New modern boats are a lot of fun but learning to sail (well) is best done on a inexpensive secondhander that can take a beating.

You probably end up with a H16 as there are so many around in the US and it has good turn-out at events. However I would advice you do a search on nacra 5.0 and nacra 500 as well. These hulls are more modern (don't have the lip) and you'll welcome that in big waves and chop. With a little luck you should be able to find one of these for about the same price as a Hobie 16. I also think that a Nacra 5.0 or 500 take the upgrade of a spinnaker better if you ever want to go that route. The nacra 5.0 or 500 could proof to be a very good lead up to the more modern boats of I-17R, FX-one and F16's.

Kind regards and fair winds to you

Wouter

Hello BLS,

Go to the Memorial Day race in PR.

A I-20 from St. Croix will race.

It is a sponsered boat, which means, it is in 11% condition. A real nice tradewinds racer.

The owner just bought a Tornado to race next season. The I-20 is for sale.

The price will surprize you. It is in your range.

You could race this boat for the next 10 years and do well.

regards,

Bruce
St. Croix

Harper,

I need to get a dig camera. The one I have is crappy and wouldn't do any good to take pix. I plan on buying one soon for my trip to FL, so as soon as I get it, I'll take some pix for you. I know you live in vastly different conditions, but the kite kicks butt.

I had the boat out today and had a great time. I still need to dial it in going upwind. I can't figure it out. Sometimes, it scoots closer to the wind than my 18, other times, I'm bearing off a lot to keep the speed up. Well, that's one of the reasons I got a new boat....it's always fun to figure it out. Any tips you have would be great.

Have a good one!

Kip
Boise, ID
FX-1

Well Brobru......
I will be going to the races this coming weekend and I'll be looking for some boats that may be for sale. I'll check out the I-20 but it's bigger than I would like, afterall I'm just starting and I plan on mostly sailing solo. The I-20 would be too big for me.

I'm looking for something cheap for now, something that I can beatup on until I have more time on the water. After that I think I'll be looking at F16, they seem very exciting and I think the class has a great future as it will fill the needs of solo sailors like myself. Well that's my boat purchasing plans at this moment and they are certainly subject to change.


Are you going to be at the Coors regatta?

BLS

hey Kip....anytime...when you get a chance,,,Im in no hurry...when you are upwind whats your setting for traveler,downhaul,outhaul...whats your usual wind and sea conditions....Harper..

BLS,

Nope,...not going,....for those other readers,..the COORS regatta in Puerto Rico gives MONEY to each class as a prize! ,...

..I believe the 1st,...2nd and 3rd.....get money,..

..correct me on this BLS..

regards,
Bruce
St. Croix

ps.''hopefully I will be sailing with Harper,..once he gets back from vacation...

Yup, you are right...heres the link Coors Light Sundance Regatta

and some more info here Club Nautico PR

I think the categories are :
1. Spinnaker Racing
2. J 24
3. Racing/Cruising
4. Jib & Main (Dacron sails; Single headsail)
5. Beach Cats
6. Open Class

Soooo come on over, the more competition the better!

Broken Leg Sailor....

The recommendations to start on a H16 are sound and a cant lose option. I have been CAT sailing since the 70s and the H16 is the absolute cheapest, easiest to find, easy to sell beach cat around. In our area, they come up under $1000 frequently; my last two 16s didn't cost over $500, the better of the two was actually $400. Although harder to find at this price, they come up far more frequently than you would imagine.

While technologically in the dark ages, the Hobie 16 with its asymmetrical hulls and lack of daggerboards, still is a blast to sail. It's one of the best BEATERS on the coast and used parts float around on ebay all the time. Dan Berger of VA Beach sells used gear as well (I got a sound pair of white hulls, frame, tramp for $200 with good bottoms).

Carry a friend or two out for an easy going cruise or power up and hit the trap(s) for a full-on blast. Two can rule on a properly rigged H16 with grins all around. Of course, in heavy air with swells offshore, you learn to develop ye olde "third eye" on that leeward hull watching for the sub action.

You ask about soloing... Well, on the H16, this is not for the faint of heart in 15knts and above. I would recommend a LOT OF TRAP time with the tiller and a full understanding of sail control before attempting this. Still, soloing on my H16 is my favorite - Flying a hull solo offshore in 12-15knts on a H16 is the CHEAPEST CAT BLAST you can do! Smooth reactions with proper weight distribution, helm control, and minute trim corrections on the main are very important (done smoothly). Yet on a good day with steady air, you can fly a hull solo till you get TIRED of it...


H16 solo offshore - see land in distance - broken halyard, old Chuck Taylors, Birdwells, seat of pants
"cheap" fun - Definition of Beach CAT sailing!

Want to move up? Simply sell your beater H16 for what you paid for it and move on. I have never lost money on a H16. And even after moving up the cat chain, I still regard it as one of the best beater beach cats around. Look for white hulls, 83 and later (lighter). Inspect bottoms for wear and area forward of front pillars for softness (press down on deck).

Hobie 16 = CHEAP - PLENTIFUL - PARTS - STILL A BLAST....

Kelly

BLS,

yep,...you are right,....nice links,...

...for the rest of you,..$30,000 ,.....yes, ..no typo,...

...$30,000 USD in prize money,....and they give it all away each year!


regards,
Bruce
St. Croix

Harper,

I've only been on the boat about 1/2 dozen times so far, so I still have a lot of learning to do. So far, I've been in everything from a drifter to about 18 knots. Inland sailing, so chop vs waves.

Let's say 10-12 knots....outhaul is tight whenever I go upwind, downhaul to take the wrinkles out, traveler centered and sheeted in tight. In wind over that, downhaul goes on first, then work the main, if I'm still overpowered, I travel down a bit.

What is your mast rake and do you have your mast prebent? Also, I saw some of your pix a while back and you seem to have a bit more draft in the main than mine....have you tapered the battens at all?

Thanks for the input!

Kip

I have plans to look at a 95 H16 in a couple of weeks. I'm not sure the condition but I think it should be in great shape, the people who sail it are regular sailors and race quite often. The asking price is $3000 without a trailor, is this too high?. What should I look for when inspecting the boat, I have a list but I might be missing a few items and maybe I'm not quite sure how to check each item. What should the boat include? Any info will be helpful.

Thanks,
BLS

Hi Kip,

I was wondering what rating you get sailing two-up on the FX-1? If you look at the USSA-Portsmouth Yardstick Multihull corrections, you only get a multiplier of 1.01 for sailing in excess of 130% of the class minimum. There does not seem to be a correction for two-up on a single-hander.
I often race with two on my FX-1 with the jib. Seems about as fast as single, but the corrections work against me because you take a .975 hit for the jib and only get 1.01 for the extra body, so that you end up with:
FX-1 solo, no spin = 71.2
FX-1, 2-up w/jib = 70.1
This says the 2-up w/jib is faster by about a minute per hour sailed

I prefer sailing it 2-up (I actually agree with Wouter that it may be too buoyant, especially for my mere 160 lbs), but I don't think it is that much faster.

Thanks!

Steve
Hobie FX-1 (2?) Sail # 211

Steve,
What is the correction factor for a spinnaker?

For example, there is no number for a spinnaker I-17 normal.

thanks,

Bruce
St. Croix

Kip...sounds to me like you are doing everything right...one thing I failed to mention is mast rotation,,,in 10-12,I have the mast set in front of the shrouds,,,bigger wind further back,,,my mast is set on the third hole up on the chain plate....mast prebend is set to heavy air,,,check your tuning guide,,,,you should have gotten one when you got the boat....one other thing ,,,where are you when you are trapped out??...I put my feet of either side of the dagger boards....in 10-12 you might let the outhaul out about an inch,,,see if that helps,,,,Harper