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Female Skippers #58389
10/04/05 03:02 PM
10/04/05 03:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
waterbug_wpb  Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Mary,

I know you had touched on this topic before, but it has been established in beachcat racing that the fat guy should really be crewing, and the lighter person on the stick. With some of the minimum weights these days on even the F-18, it would appear that a female skipper would be ideal.

Is it the male ego that prevents this combination? I recall Les from team Fully Involved used to be lethal when his wife drove and he pulled strings. He was about 225# and she was 110# (soaking wet with gear).

So how does one encourage females to drive and race?


Jay

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Female Skippers [Re: waterbug_wpb] #58390
10/04/05 06:42 PM
10/04/05 06:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Quote
So how does one encourage females to drive and race?

To answer that question I would either have to write a book or say I don't know. So, I don't know.

Re: Female Skippers [Re: waterbug_wpb] #58391
10/04/05 07:04 PM
10/04/05 07:04 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,911
South Florida & the Keys
arbo06 Offline
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South Florida & the Keys
Why should the fat guy crew? Would that not create more weight distibution problems and interupt attachment as the chubby one moves to and fro?


Eric Arbogast
ARC 2101
Miami Yacht Club
Re: Female Skippers [Re: arbo06] #58392
10/04/05 07:54 PM
10/04/05 07:54 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,921
Michigan
PTP Offline
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Michigan
the fat dude could put some serious force down for a "roll-tack"

Re: Female Skippers [Re: PTP] #58393
10/04/05 09:17 PM
10/04/05 09:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 141
Panama City Beach, FL
steveh Offline
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steveh  Offline
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Posts: 141
Panama City Beach, FL
What about a 10 or 12:1 main for the skinny chick, or does the the fat dude have to pull all the strings?

Re: Female Skippers [Re: arbo06] #58394
10/04/05 09:18 PM
10/04/05 09:18 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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South Carolina
Fat dude forward = good.


Jake Kohl
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Jake] #58395
10/04/05 09:19 PM
10/04/05 09:19 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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South Carolina
crew pulls all the strings anyway. Seriously, upwind in a blow, crew on F18 constantly works the main to leave the skipper able to drive smooth. I crewed for the first time in a while on an F18 last weekend and after a lap - I was surprised at how hard I was breathing.


Jake Kohl
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Jake] #58396
10/04/05 09:22 PM
10/04/05 09:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,921
Michigan
PTP Offline
Carpal Tunnel
PTP  Offline
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Michigan
I'm can't even really pull the main in on the 6.0 with one hand, and the tiller under the arm thing really just isn't stylish. After the RTI, my crew needed a couple weeks off to let his hands heal.

Re: Female Skippers [Re: PTP] #58397
10/04/05 09:23 PM
10/04/05 09:23 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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South Carolina
You should try 5 days of that.


Jake Kohl
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Jake] #58398
10/04/05 09:26 PM
10/04/05 09:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,921
Michigan
PTP Offline
Carpal Tunnel
PTP  Offline
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Michigan
At Tybee? yeah, I would need to add one more level of purchase... or have my crew use one of those hand strengthening springs for months prior. It really becomes an endurance issue- not even the hands.. just staying on the trap for any extended length of time.

Last edited by PTP; 10/04/05 09:27 PM.
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Jake] #58399
10/04/05 09:36 PM
10/04/05 09:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 141
Panama City Beach, FL
steveh Offline
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steveh  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 141
Panama City Beach, FL
Quote
crew pulls all the strings anyway. Seriously, upwind in a blow, crew on F18 constantly works the main to leave the skipper able to drive smooth.


The things you learn at catsailor.com. This also means that my crews's... errr... skipper's tweaked shoulder won't keep her off the boat.

Re: Female Skippers [Re: Mary] #58400
10/05/05 02:54 AM
10/05/05 02:54 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
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Quote

So how does one encourage females to drive and race?


Build up slowly, work on confidence and trust in the boat andn crew first. Never yell (unless REALLY necessary) Never curse (ever). Let her do things wrong for extended times while patiently mentioning the correct way of doing it. Then after some time has passed and only then slowly get more involved in learning (which you'll call showing) her the right way. For some reason a sizeable portion of women expect lots of time to get the hang of something. Give them that. Correcting her before she feels that she has had her time to find out independently seems to make many annoyed.

But when it starts working out it is fantastic !

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Wouter] #58401
10/05/05 04:14 AM
10/05/05 04:14 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
All right, I'll say a few things:

If a woman can drive a car at 65 miles an hour on hard pavement on a crowded freeway, she can certainly drive a sailboat at 15 mph on a relatively soft surface like water.

Both people on the boat should know how to sail and how to do all the jobs on the boat, including helming.

Who does which job at any given time is a matter of what works best for weight distribution and what needs the most strength, depending upon weather conditions and who is best at handling specific situations.

It is easier for a woman to be on the helm in long-distance races where you are on the same tack for long periods of time and there are not other boats in close proximity. Let the weaker person steer and the stronger person handle the sheets and downhaul.

Buoys racing is another matter. Most (not all) women are not as aggressive as men, and they don't like situations where there are a lot of boats in close proximity. So what you do in this case is the man does the start. After the boats spread out a little after the start, you change positions and put the woman on the helm. In heavy air the man will be better positioned to handle the mainsheet and downhaul. In light air, strength is not needed, but his weight will be better positioned forward.

If there is a windy, fast-reaching leg after the weather mark, you should change places again, prior to getting to the weather mark, so the heavier person is at the back of the boat.

On the downwind legs, job or position should be based upon best weight distribution for the conditions and where strength is most needed.

Mark roundings, again, are intimidating for some people, both men and women, so if you see a crowded leeward mark rounding coming up, you switch places if necessary to put the more aggressive or experienced sailor on the helm.

This switching of places on the boat during the race is the same thing you can do when you are training children or novice racers of either gender.

You start out doing this team-switch thing in light-air conditions and gradually work up to moderate winds. And while you are doing this training process, don't ever yell and do not ever make it feel stressful to the person in training. Once she is on the helm, she is the one who is going to get motivated to figure out how to beat those other boats. She is going to start asking questions.

But the really really best way to get a woman hooked on helming is to get her racing a singlehander in a group of other women sailors on boats like Sunfish or Waves.

Re: Female Skippers [Re: Mary] #58402
10/05/05 05:18 AM
10/05/05 05:18 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
THIS is how you get women on the helm.

The attachment is me on starboard and Kristin on port during our first annual Women's Day Regatta, in September, at Put-in-Bay Yacht Club, Ohio. We had eight women racing in the 12-race round-robin event on four Hobie Waves.

Attached Files
58935-IMG_5021.JPG (195 downloads)
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Mary] #58403
10/05/05 05:27 AM
10/05/05 05:27 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
And here's another one from our regatta. Margot being creative with her downwind helming technique.

Attached Files
58936-IMG_5001.JPG (156 downloads)
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Mary] #58404
10/05/05 07:38 AM
10/05/05 07:38 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
T
Tom Korz Offline
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Tom Korz  Offline
addict
T

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
How about this

Attached Files
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Tom Korz] #58405
10/05/05 07:39 AM
10/05/05 07:39 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
T
Tom Korz Offline
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Tom Korz  Offline
addict
T

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
under way......

Attached Files
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Tom Korz] #58406
10/05/05 07:52 AM
10/05/05 07:52 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
T
Tom Korz Offline
addict
Tom Korz  Offline
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T

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
FWI....if you check out our fleet web site you will see many women skippers, oh yeah they own their own boats, too!!

204 home page


Attached Files
58943-100_1001.JPG (133 downloads)
Re: Female Skippers [Re: Tom Korz] #58407
10/05/05 08:56 AM
10/05/05 08:56 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,074
Northfield,NH USA
bullswan Offline
Pooh-Bah
bullswan  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,074
Northfield,NH USA
Hey Tom,
Is that Foxy's on Jost Van Dyke that is mentioned on your spin? Does he have his own line of Lager? I have a pen and ink over my desk here that is signed by Foxy himself dated 1990. It shows a couple of hammocks and when the going gets tough it's nice to look up and picture myself floating the day away on "Foxy's Painkillers". Good Times.


The nice part about being a pessimist is that you are constantly being either proven right or pleasantly surprised. - George Will
"It's not that liberals aren't smart, it's just that so much of what they know isn't so" -Ronald Reagan
Re: Female Skippers [Re: bullswan] #58408
10/05/05 09:29 AM
10/05/05 09:29 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
T
Tom Korz Offline
addict
Tom Korz  Offline
addict
T

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 454
Syracuse, NY Hobie Fleet 204
Susan & Davis recieved sponsorship from Virgin Ilsand Brewing for their Worrell campaign in 2000. There were 2 brews at that time and I believe there still are to this day. Foxy's Lager (lighter) & Blackbeard Ale (Darker)

Susan had her I20 in the VI for the winter 1999 to train for the W1000. I got to sail it down there a bit too!! Yipee!!!

Davis still lives in St Thomas

Point High & Foot Fast

Tom

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