Is the language on the DVD French or does it also have English ?

Wouter

Never mind I got it. For anybody else who is interested (DVD's contain English and French language tracks):

http://www.equator-editions.com/boutique/liste_produits.cfm?type=10&code_lg=lg_fr

ORMA DVD 2005 = 24.90 Euro
ORMA DVD 2004 = 19.00 Euro

Official ORMA site (you have to understand French) :

http://www.multis-online.com/

Wouter

Wouter,
You are quite right that windsurfers will not perform to their maximum in choppy water, I windsurf at the same lake that our speedsailing league is held, and the top guys at speed are unbelievable, when I am backing off and getting airborne, they are locked in and flying. But they are on the right equipment (F2 Missile, Naish Stealth sails), and one of them holds the African record, the other holds the kite world speed record. I see from the SA speed league site http://www.windsurfingafrica.org/GPSSpeedLeague/tabid/834/Default.aspx
that they have 10sec, 100m, 250m records, so not only measured over 2sec, my mistake. At these speeds you will sail 100m in 5sec, I just don`t think you will see a beachcat do that unless it`s on it`s trailer.
What the windsurfer guys have to worry about is those pesky kitesurfers getting faster, and faster ...
With regard to the tri vs windsurfer video, I`ll agree, no doubt the tri was not making the effort, looking at the water and windsurfer rig size and board choice, it would have been around 18-20knots windspeed, no white horses, very little chop. My guess would be their average speed was around 22-25knots in those conditions, which is consistent to how fast they appear to be going - 40knots looks a whole lot different.
And yes, knees make remarkable shock-absorbers, our creator was the first engineer, none have come close to replicating anything that came off his drawing board.

Hi all,

can't keep my nose out when the subject goes to sailboards V's Multihulls and speed.

The sailboards don't have to be in a purpose made trench to get high top speeds, recently at Sandy Point a couple 100kms. from where I live, sailboards reached speeds of 45kts. When a low pressure system came in from Bass Strait, mind you winds where gusting 40 to 50 kts. at the time!!!!!!!!!

I have sailed there myself a few times I believe it is one of the best natural speed sailing locations in the world.

But when it comes to sustained speeds in open water nothing can beat a big Multi. The bigger it is the higher the sustained speeds, I have seen speeds of around 30 kts. for miles on the ones I have sailed on.

I have also had the opportunity to line up a few Formula Race boards including the new Olympic board with my F16 they are easy pickings in under 15 kts. With the kite up and a hull out of the water the F16 kills them for speed.

Regards Gary.

Sandy Point has all the same ingrediants as the trench...... It is very sheltered from waves, very shallow so the chop does not pick right up and gets good breeze from the Southern ocean.

It is a natural made speed sailing course and is where Maquarie Inovation is attempting to take back thier record and be the first over the 50 knot mark.

Unfortunatly it is a smallish body of water and MI must enter the course at low speed from behind a sand dune and try and hit super high speeds to reach a good average. They have said MI has alread exited the course in excess of 50 knots.... Just got to get a better entry speed.



MI with a minor setback..... They reported that they were traveling @ 45 knots early in the run when this happened. It was set to be a record run they believe...... It has now been rebuilt much lighter and stronger.


Previous record holded Yellow Pages

They both look kinda' like this:

http://www.mit.edu/people/robot/mh/riwuit/scan069.JPG

Check out Hobies web site and their Tri Cat video, those guys are blowing wind surfers out of the water.

Ok, you win..
fastest windsurfer over 500m = 48 knots.
fastest cat over 500m = 23 knots
Clearly, cats are much faster, in the eyes of those who believe.

Go tornado go!!

Wooo hooo, a 60 footer can beat an 8 footer!

No, windsurfers are NOT restricted to the trench. The current OPEN WATER world speed record is 44.35 knots.....faster than any cat has recorded over an official trial, anywhere.

The PRODUCTION board record is 43.44 knots.....faster than any cat has recorded over an official trial, anywhere.

Back in the late '70s or 1980, before there were short boards, harnesses or footstraps a board did about 19.7 knots (officially) at the Weymouth trials....

Maxicats have recorded over 44 knots offshore, fully crewed and provisoned.
Someone in this forum commented that they might try the outright speed record, if they stripped the boat of everything unnecessary for the short sprint.
Also, Orange II is bigger and faster than the maxicat that recorded over 44 (Orange I, probably).

Ok, so a fully-geared 130 footer has "recorded" only a few knots less than the speeds an 8 footer has AVERAGED over 500m.

While obviously it's silly to get excited when comparing a round-the-world boat with a board, surely it is also bizarre to get all het up when a 60 footer is racing an 8 footer.

Altered's info is interesting....I'd love to see the F16 and A in a full series against FW boards and foiler Moths, I think the FW boards may be eating their claims that they are the fastest things around a course.

(Actually Altered DID race and beat the world's fastest Moth foiler, but the Moth foiler decided that since the conditions weren't perfect for him, he wasn't going to count that regatta!)

Hi who me,

when did "Alered" beat the Worlds fatest foiling Moth? Please refresh my failing memory and introduce yourself, assuming I was there, I have probably met you.

When speaking to Rohan Veal he has never claimed the foiler Moth has a sailboard type top speed, my recollection was he said about 19kts. The secret to the foiler Moth's speed, is it's average speed around the course, however control is it's problem, when compared to the other craft capable of similar speeds, the Tornado, A class, F18 and F16 don't crash as much, I am afraid I don't have experience with the current racing sailboards around a course to add them to this list.

However I think it would be very unusual for any of them to attain over 20 kts. but in their ideal windspeeds they will travel at around 15 kts. regularly. Each having it's ideal windspeed and wave state, allowing them to excel in the conditions that suit.

In 12-14 kts. of wind "Altered" has been recorded on a Radar Gun at a top speed of 32km/hr, nothing to amazing but the lowest speed was 29km/hr over a series of runs, it is the average speed that is the impressive factor, allowing for exciting performance around a course in anything over 8kts. of wind however Altered's speed peaks at about 15 kts. of wind, this is when the two up cats come in to there own.

I too would love to see F16 one up v's A class, Foiler Moth and Sailboard, around a windward and return course, but fact is they are probably all capable of winning in their ideal conditions.

Regards Gary. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

A cat that big doesn't decelerate fast. It is very likely that they ran over more than 500 meters when the speed was recorded. But this is not important. A windsurfer is amazingly fast for its simplicity and price. A monster multihull is expensive and complicated, but more consistent overall. Not much to discuss, really.

"When did "Alered" beat the Worlds fastest foiling Moth? Please refresh my failing memory and introduce yourself, assuming I was there, I have probably met you."

It was at the Brass Monkey regatta at the Squaddy; Alerted 35th, Rohan on Amac's boat =52nd (no finishes).

I know you both had gear failure (didn't we all, and yep you do know me....) but from where I was you looked clearly faster in terms of consistent speed. Until Rohan retired in R1, he'd only made up 1 minute in 2 miles on the NS14 and the top Cherubs, you'd come and passed us. Ok, you crashed but so did he, and you were much faster until you both had problems.

R3 was a walkover for the F16s. I think we were all together 1/3 of the way up the beat and by the time I got to the top mark you were well ahead, and he was so far behind his sail numbers couldn't be read.

Of course, it wasn't a great test. The Moth is amazing, as we all know, and the conditions were terrible for it. But the Mothies will talk it up when they beat As and Tornadoes and 49ers, so why can't other people mention it when they get beaten?

Which is not to say that Moths, FWs, As, F16s etc are not stunning machines, I think you're dead right the winner would be the one that had its favoured conditions.

We used to get some FW guys (including one we raced against in raceboards way back when, I think) pacing the KCC fleet at times. In 20 knots or so I'm sure they paced Dave Hart's T and Steve Brewin's A downwind, and they were pretty close to Taipan pace upwind for VMG.

The comment about the FWs and Moths comes from the fact that some FW guys believe that nothing else comes close to them, yet rohan reckons he's as fast upwind, and under 6-8 knots he's much faster all-round.

By the way, re-reading the Brass Monkey thread reminded me that the regatta clearly went to the A Class, with Elvis averaging about 45 knots in Race 1 (check the times...he finished the 6 mile? windward/leeward course in 10 minutes!).

THAT'S fast!!!!!!!!!!! :-)

PS do you get the feeling that any comparisons of all-round speed are getting harder and harder to make these days? Many boats these days seem to have more holes or strong points in their performance than those of 20 years ago. Even when we were racing boards, most of them were more consistent in their performance than an FW board, and shortboards didn't come into it because they couldn't do course races. Even Scow Moths didn't change performance across the wind range like a foiler Moth does, and all fast cats were kiteless.

Just an idea.

Here in Britain the F16's are starting to race regularly against the A's as a way of increasing the number of boats at regattas, at the last event it was a simple 1st boat over the line wins which worked pretty well, uninformed ( well sort of informed ) views are that the A's are quicker in winds up to about 10 knots and then the F16's are quicker in anything above that, the other good thing is that the people who race both classes are pretty like minded people and the apres sailing is a real blast ( far too many sore heads the next day ). This grouping does seem to work well.

To make the discusion on speed sailing on different machines even more complicated.
http://www.grandprixpetitnavire.com/defi/video.php#
have fun
Kris