We are mostly sailing on Lake Michigan and have several older boats at the beach here (no harm done when kids jump on them).

We are semi-retired now and will be spending a month or two a year (spring & fall) at my place in Germany and travel in Europe. There I want to keep a cat in my garage and take it for sailing - either to the North Sea or some Bavarian / Austrian lakes.

I've had my mind for a long time on a Taipan 4.9 (maybe a Taipan F-16) or a Spitfire (liking the Spitfire better from the optical viewpoint).

We are recreational sailors -absolutely no racing- but like to invest nevertheless on a fast, light and high-performance boat.

I know that new Taipans and Spitfires are a bit easier to procure in Europe than in the U.S.(-maybe Wouter has some ideas as to dealers in the Netherlands or Germany??), although I dread the relative high price in Euros, considering the ever-falling U.S. dollar value, LOL!

Anyway, I'd like to get some feedback on either boat listed -
we are ready to go for it now and I just need some opinions from the catsailor community as to the pros & cons of the Spitfire & Taipans. I personally am not that detail-oriented as to the nitty gritty of the minutiae of the equipment details, but my partner is.

So bring it on!

I see you have a N5.8na.

For reference, the Taipan 4.9 is about the same speed, weighs significantly less and is easy to rig, move around, and right singlehandedly. It is well made and strong. It cannot carry as much crew weight as the N5.8, but can carry more than a H16.

Adding the spinnaker adds a lot of fun to the 4.9 but will increase rigging time.

There are some 4.9s available in the US--send me a private message if you'd like more info/details.

Look in our classified page.., there are two Taipan 4.9 for sale
Rick

Thanks, guys, for the tips. But I am looking to buy a new boat in Europe (Netherlands, Ireland or Germany, not a used Taipan in the U.S.

I just wanted to know the pros & cons of the Taipan (F-16 / 4.9) and the Spitfire.

So, if one of you European catsailors could chime in??

Well, I think Wouter is the man to get in touch with. There used to be a Taipan dealer in Germany- Sigrid, used to correspond with a lot several years ago- They had a German website- You could probably find if they are still around via Google. I love my Taipan but have not yet had the opportunity to see a Spitfire. If you are primarily interested in recreational sailing I would definitely recommend the self-tacker jib, the stock Taipan is slightly narrower- May be easier towing/stowing in garage than the F16 version.

Kirt

Okay Cat-woman find yourself a nice chair and get ready for this report by a European (Taipan F16) sailor.

I will cover all boats available in Europe so you can make an informed choice.

The model available in Europe are. Stealth F16, Taipan F16, Blade F16 and of course the Spitfire.

I think the Spitfire can be bought in Northern France and the Stealth ( www.stealthmarine.co.uk )is sold direct from factory in UK. The Taipan F16 can be bought from Sven Lindstadt ( http://www.lindstaedt.com/ ) in Germany and the Blade F16 is available from the importer in the Netherlands ( www.catamaranparts.nl ). The last is close enough to Germany to be considered local. The Blade importer will now be stocking boats. Sadly they sell just as quickly. But that is a different subject. Sven delivers on order I believe (Taipans). The builder of the Taipan (AHPC) is however looking to replace the Taipan F16 (and Taipan 4.9) with a completely new design; the Capricorn F16. I don't know yet when this new design will be available to customers. We'll probably know after our Global challenge event in Singapore (feb 2007). Stealth marine continiously upgrades their design and they are always immediately available to customers. I don't really know who is stocking spitfires. The Dutch agent certainly isn't; I seriously doubt whether he ever sold more then 2 Spitfires. For some reason the Spitfire just doesn't seem to catch on outside of UK and Northern France. And lets not forget Ireland.

Anyway back to topic pro's and cons.

Lets first look at your criteria :





I will start on comparing the two boats selected but later on I will argue that you really need to broaden your horizon and look at the Blade F16 and Stealth F16 designs.


Either way a Spitfire and Taipan will provide you with a fast en high performance double handing boat.

The Taipan is definately the lightest (production) doublehander around with an earmark for quality. Over 320 boats have been build since 1989 and this design has fully earned the quality reputation it has now. It is the lightest boat in the F16 class as shown by the newer 13 boats being 102 kg (ex spinnaker) at the 2002 nationals. A proper spinnaker package is under 5 kg's. So this boat in its standard setup will be at minimum F16 class weight. ( see for data the following link : http://www.geocities.com/f16hpclass/F16HP_optimal_crew_weight_datapoints.html )




The Spitfire was weighted at 135 kg at the lowest as far as I know. The Texel officials measured it at 138 kg. The ISAF/SCHRS officials had it at 139 kg. So I think it is fair to say that a brand new Spitfire is at least 30 kg heavier then a brand new the Taipan 4.9 or Taipan F16. Personally I feel that 10 kg may be negligiable but not 30 kg. (30 kg = 66 lbs)

Both the Taipan F16 and Spitfire are 2.5 mtr wide and will sometimes not fit through older garage doors. The Taipan 4.9 at 2.34 mtr typically does. This may be a consideration.

The Taipan is fully suited to singlehanded sailing while the Spitfire isn't really. The Taipan features a lightweight mast that allows singlehanded righting of the boat. The Spitfire mast is about 3 kg heavier and will therefor require about 12-15 kg (26 - 33 lbs) more body weight to right the boat. That is alot in opinion and therefor I personally don't consider the Spitfire rightable by a solo sailor (under all conditions especially flat water and light breeze).

The spitfire has an excellent racing cirquit in UK and maybe some in Northern France although I do not hear much about the last. The Taipan 4.9 boats in Europe were unable to form their own class and now more and more boats are upgrading to the F16 setup which does seem to catch on overhere in Europe now. Both in the UK and the mainland. In all honesty the Taipan 4.9 design is dying as a class. Sooner or later it will be replaced by the Capricorn F16 (same builder) and other F16's. From this perspective it is not wise to buy a Taipan 4.9 anymore. If anything buy a Taipan F16. This one will outlive the 4.9 in the F16 class; also it is an updated design with selftacking jib and other must-have-stuff. It is just a better boat then the 4.9 even though they share many features and components. The Spitfire class is strenious in mainland Europe. I don't know where it is going, but it is not making a strong showing on the mainland yet. You may want to factor that in when you invest in a new boat. I'm sorry to say but a Spitfire remained on secondhand offer for over 18 months here in Netherlands, while F16's generally move on to the next owner within 1 or 2 months.

In my personal experience the F16's (and Taipans) grow with the F18's to higher speeds as both are true formula classes. The spitfire design is stationary as it is a strict One-Design class. Some 5 years ago they could compete very well with the F18's in open regatta's, now the Spitfires are having increasing difficulties matching the newer F18's in speeds. See this post by a spitfire sailor : http://www.catsailor.com/forums/sho...Number=76804&page=0&vc=1

In my opinion the Spitfires are growing backwards by standing still while the F16's maintain a check on the larger catamaran scene by allowing themselfs to gradual develop with the times. I think this seriously impacts positively on the resale value and the attractiveness of the investment. Afterall, the Taipan design (from 1989) has been kept alive all this time by allowing it to incorporated new features thus becoming the Taipan F16. And in this setup it is still giving F18's a very good run for their money.

Now if anyone would ask me personally what I think then I'll say that I believe that F16 will push the Spitfire class out of the mainland European catamaran scene. Or rather that the F16 class will enclose the Spitfire design into itself as it has done with the Taipan 4.9. This will keep the Spitfire design alive but probably end the OD (one-design) Spitfire class in the long run.

I personally haven't sailed the Spitfire design, so I can't comment on how it sails. I really do know that the Taipan F16 is a very pleasant boat to sail. Anybody who comes of any other boat says so. Maybe with the expection of the A-cat sailors, but they do recognise how much the Taipan resembles the A-cats of about a decade ago and that level is still many years ahead of any other production design out there. Dive recovery is excellent and the boat/rig really does talk to you while sailing. It lets you know what it likes and wants, immediately. I consider the Spitfire rig to be of a more older generation, just like the older F18's had. All the new F18 design however are all upgrading to the true wingshaped mast and rigs and the Taipan had that rig ever since 1989 already ! So it was (together with the A-cats) over 15 years ahead of its time.

Having said all this in direct comparison I now want to make the case for the other F16 designs.

First the Stealth F16. For 12.000 Euro's (cheaper then a race ready European Hobie 16 !) you'll get a well designed F16 boat that comes standard with a carbon mast. This is the lightest mast available on any of these boats. It is most likely 6 kg lighter then the Spitfire mast and THAT you'll notice while sailing and righting the boat. Other standard items. Epoxy resin hulls, Pentex race ready Ullman sails and T-foil rudders. For 12.000 Euro's this is one massive "bang for the buck" F16. Remember, you can't even get a race ready Hobie 16 for that price here in Europe ! WOW !

Last but certainly not least the Blade F16.

We now have one of these boats at my club and it did some training against the new Nacra infusion F18 today. That is a F18 with the new true wingmast rig. The Blade uses the Taipan rig, also a true wingmast rig design. Let me say that the Blade F16 owner was smiling all over. Two thumbs up when he walked up the beach to the club house. He was sailing the boat in earnest for the first time the infusion crew is a former European nacra 5.8 champion and had on the water training by the Infusion agent in the past weeks. The Blade owner can sail very well, that must be said, he is a former hobie and prindle champion as well but it is still his first sail on the boat. I watched them go side by side for long stretches. The Blade crew was still too new to the spinnaker to hang on to the infusion then, but on the legs without the spi they were making excellent speed.

I've also talked to many new Blade F16 owners over the past months, several of them former Taipan 4.9 owners. And everybody says the same thing. The Blade F16 is one fine catamaran design. It just has excellent feel combined with high speed. When the Blade was designed it tried to keep all the good stuff of the Taipan design while improving on the lesser points and it did so in excellent terms. There is just no other word to describe it. It currently comes fitted with one of the very best rudder boards available on the market today. I'm not writing this up. This is the core of the comments of the new owners. No matter what you do, you can be 2 feet into a dive, the rudders keep working and the boat always remains under full control. A Dutch Blade F16 owner hit a wave the wrong way (or something) and send his crew flying forward. He landed on the spi pole, the bow burried fully, but the boat kept sailing and the skipper steered the boat to a better course. His crew climbed past the spi pole stepped of the bow section of the leeward hull, all while the boat kept sailing, and moved back to the trampoline on the lee side. There he got back on board. All the while the skipper on the helm was in full control (his words). That is what makes the Blade F16 special. You can let go of the tiller and the baot will keep tracking straight or continue on its initially set curve. The boat truly tacks on a dime. Everybody says it. The boat just feels very good, it is a pleasure to sail.

But here comes another important bit. The boat is good looking. It is unbelievable. Time and time again you hear it from passers by. Sailors of other makes come along, check it out and express their approval of the looks. This has been no different in the USA, Asia, Aus or elsewhere. I can probably rig a Blade F16 in front of the club and have it sold by the end of the day. It certainly feels that way. I don't really know what it is; it just has something that really gets to people.

In this sense I feel that the Blade F16 will be a very good investment. It is at least on a par with the newest designs out there (including the F18's) and it has the looks and sailing feel to be a wanted item many years from now. Additionally it is priced at least 1000 Euro's cheaper then the Taipan F16. If you are seriously considering the Taipan 4.9 then you should really consider the Taipan F16 (same price but better), but then again if you are seriously considering the Taipan F16 (I have one myself) then you should in fact consider the Blade F16. The last is better still and cheaper at the same time. Plus it appears to be the benchmark in the F16 class for the next 5 years. It is honestly that good.

I'm not really allowed to write this, but both Taipan and Stealth sailors have test sailed the boat and several Taipan sailors have now upgraded to the Blade and I don't think we'll have to wait long to have a convert from the Stealth design as well. I have a feeling that I know his name already. Actually, we already have one, I forgot about Paul. Okay what I'm trying to say is we expect a second one soon. We already have the A-cat converts. This to me says something. All these guys already know what a truely high performance lightweight catamaran is and if they favour the Blade F16 then that says something.

In this light I personally don't rate the Spitfire very high anymore. I'm truly sorry, I do really think that the design would be better if it had let go of the (limiting) One-Design setup. It is just holding it back. I believe the basic design is very good but to make it come out better it really does have to go with the times and use 2006 technology instead of the 1998 state of art. I don't believe it is cheaper then the Blade F16 so what is the point ? Contact Hans Klok of www.catamaranparts.nl for info and pricing on the Blade F16

I personally say get the best design available for the amount you are willing to spend on it. If you budget allows a new boat in Europe then you don't really get any better (in the way of design) then the Blade F16. With the Stealth F16 and Taipan F16 as seconds. Probably with the Stealth F16 a little ahead by virtue of the carbon mast and its very attractive price (3000 Euro's cheaper then the Taipan !). On the third row you'll find the Spitfire and below that the FX-one and nacra I-17.

So that is my personal report. My personal advice goes along the lines described in the paragraph above.

Please also note that a new F18 costs 18.000 Euro's or more. So apart from being lighter and more technologically advanced the F16's are also several thousand Euro's cheaper !

I hope this helps,

Wouter

If you are interested in a new or 2nd hand Spitfire in mainland Europe contact www.france-catamaran.com
I love my Spitfire - it is a beautiful cat to sail and race. In lil old Ireland, it still does OK against the F18s.

Hey Dermot,

Maybe you can tell us what a new Spitfire goes for these days.

I never understood why but for some reason the prices of F16's are named on the webpages. But of other cats they are hardly ever. Does anybody know why that is exactly ? I truly wonder why.

Thanks,

WOuter

The Swell Catamarans site gives the Spitfire prices.
http://www.swell-catamarans.co.uk/products/spitfire/equipment.html
Also the Irish site gives a price (Which does not cover transport from the UK. http://www.catamaran.ie/cats/new.htm
Also I see that from the Stealth website that the real price of a Stealth ready to race is £9650.00 www.stealthmarine.co.uk Now that's not cheap <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />
I am not getting into an argument about which 16ft cat is the best. All I know is that every Spitfire is the same. And, I love mine <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

P.S I also think that the Blade is a real cool cat <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I'm not afraid to say that I feel the Spitfire is one of the better boats available on the market today. I really do put it above the nacra Inter-17 and Hobie FX-one. And I'm thrilled to see some of them come out to the F16 Global challenge in Singapore. These spitfire boats and crews are an excellent supplement to the event. They will certainly keep us all sharp, that is for sure.

This is what I think about the boat, even when in direct comparison I may favour different makes, I hope this prevents any misunderstanding between myself and Spitfire class. Hell, I'm actually one of the F16 class members (official) who actively campaigns for the Spitfire to remain included in the F16 format by maintaining its grandfather status.




Thanks, Dermot.

One more question if you will allow me that :

Which webpage is the most accurate ?

I see on the Irish webpage (dealer) that a spitfire incl. snuffer costs 12.700 Euro's while the Swell catamarans (builder) website quotes it at (boat + snuffer) = 8995 + 371 = 9366 pounds = 13.675 Euro's

Normally buying through a dealer is more expensive then buying factory direct.





The Stealth prices are quoted here http://www.geocities.com/stealthmarine2002/spec2006.html

You've seen those Dermot I know. I just would now like to justify my earlier quote of the Stealth F16 for the other readers.

In the left colom one can see the basic Stealth F16, which does come standard with stuff like a carbon mast, T-foil rudders, fibrefoam battens and pentex Ullman sails. This basic (sloop rigged) doublehander costs 7950 pounds = 11610 Euro's. However I want to compare apples with apples as best as I can so I added the upgrade of the spinnaker snuffer system = 275 pounds = 400 Euro's. This comes out at a total of 12010 Euro's. This amount I indeed rounded off to 12.000 Euro's, if you'll forgive me from neglecting 10 Euro's.

I do think it is really cheap as this setup features a full carbon mast and a overall boat weight that 95 % of all the other catamaran designs out there can only dream of. If I would buy a carbon mast for my Taipan I would have to shell out at least 1500 Euro's to get one. Of course the other boats, like the Spitfire and my Taipan don't have carbon masts but aluminium ones, and both are still more expensive then the Stealth F16. On this ground I call the Stealth excellently priced. I am truly impressed with that.

The "Le Race" version of the Stealth has carbon cloth in the hulls and Carbon is extremely hard to get current. It also has some extra carbon components on the boat like Carbon rudder stocks. Additionally it has a keel line of Kevlar cloth. I guess these are the reasons why the "Le Race" version is priced 1700 pounds = 2480 Euro's more expensive then the basic version. With this in mind I do feel it is unfair to compare these carbon/kevlar hulls with the core matt hulls of the Spitfire and the glass hulls of the basic Taipan and Blades. So that is why I used the basic Stealth price in my earlier post and not the "le Race". A note to the other readers outthere. Both the Taipan and Blade designs are available with full kevlar hull construction. I think with the Blade you only pay 400 Euro's more for that, which makes it a must-have upgrade in my eyes. Kevlar hulls are GOOD !

There is one thing I like to correct myself on. Apparently the Blade F16 and Spitfire are not priced the same. From the quotes I gether that the Blade F16 is 1000 Euro's more expensive then the Spitfire. The Blade will be delivered to the Netherlands for that price however. Round trip UK is about 500 Euro's from the Netherlands with gas and teh ferry. So overall the two boats do really approach eachother in the final cost new.

I hope I have done right by everybody now.





After 2 tries I still haven't sailed it for more then a minute. Bloody winds just doesn't want to cooperate ! But rest assured I will write down a full comparison between it and my own Taipan F16 when I do get to sail it for a reasonable amount of time. Going on the reports I'm in for a treat.

Best of luck in Ireland Dermot.


Wouter


P.S. you coming out to Singapore ?

Thanks Wouter - And we were one of the first to support you with the David & Goliath Cup <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />



The Swell Site.


That is an Irish only price and to be honest, it should probably be about Euro12,850.00 The Dealer gets his discount and can then charge what he likes <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />



I am not sure that so many different options are a good idea for the Stealth(or the client). No Stealth seems to be the same <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Are they all F16s ? Are some faster than others?


I would really love to, but while the main job gives me a lot of free time in the Summer, I cannot leave home in mid Winter.
Keep up the good work <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

WOW, Wouter---thank you, thank you, thank you, for the very detailed description of the Taipan & the Spitfire!

Thanks for taking the time to explain in such detail, me & my partner REALLY appreciate all the time you put into this. It will take us a while to digest it all and weigh the pros & cons of the different models/classes.

Now I'm leaning towards a Taipan F16--I've always had an affinity for the Aussies and their long-standing success with building great cats.

Since we will use the boat exclusively for recreational purposes (no racing, no resale considerations), it's not really that important to us whether it has the latest ultimate snarky tech details, or whether it is just that nanosecond faster than another boat brand of the same class model. Of course, we'd want a self-tacking jib etc., but we don't need that carbon mast or the split dagger boards to make it a few kilos lighter.

Since we are a relatively lightweight crew, we are not looking for a F-18 (we are still very, very happy with our 10-year old Nacra 5.8na)but a smaller, more manageable and fun F-16. The Spitfire would also really be fine for our purposes. Let's face it, most of the year the boat will be unused and disassembled in my garage near Frankfurt , Germany. We will use it on occasion when we are in Europe on vacation, trailering it on the Autobahn either north (in your direction to Holland or N. Germany) or Bavaria/Austria to some of the lakes there.Maybe we will head over in your direction next year.We have friends in Belgium (Flemish) who are also cat sailors, so we have planned a joint sailing vacation for 2007.Maybe we can learn something from experts like you!

As to the price, I would imagine that the Blade is probably more expensive in Europe, then again it might not, considering the ever declining dollar vis-a-vis the Euro...who knows? I probably am inclined to get a boat that is more readily available in Europe where the F-16 class has been established longer than here in the U.S., right?

Anyway, we will mull over your suggestions and probably start contacting some of the Euro dealers to seee what deal we can get.

Many thanks again!!

Dermot,

Thanks for the info.

I think the picture is complete now.



I can't tell whether all are the same or not. Personally, I only care whether all are Formula 16 compliant. The fact that all boats may be slightly different is a natural possibility of a formula class setup. But as long as the class rules (box rule) is succesful enough in equalizing the performance of all these boats then it doesn't matter whether they are different or the same. And personally I think the F18 and F16 class rules are showing that a formula class rule set can be succesful at that.

Best of luck to everyone.

I now have to get to the beach and organise the second race day at our club of this weekend. We have a 2-day club event this weekend. Saw 3 nacra F18 Infusions appear on the start line of our clube race, together with the new Inter-20 and also the Blade F16. We have alot of new boats this year. And the crews are adjusting to their new possesions so alot of things happen. Great fun

Wouter

Since we will use the boat exclusively for recreational purposes (no racing, no resale considerations), it's not really that important to us whether it has the latest ultimate snarky tech details, or whether it is just that nanosecond faster than another boat brand of the same class model.



One last question. What is your combined crew weight ?




You should drop by. Also when you have decided contact me. There are a few Taipan/Blade sailors in Germany and they are looking to grow the class there and maybe form the German association.



Well,I'm not an expert. I got my butt handed to me by a proper Aussie Taipan crew; they were bloody fast. But I do alright.





Roughly

Stealth F16 12010
Spitfire 13.675
Blade F16 14.500
Taipan F16 16.000 (but does come with kevlar hull construction for this, while others are plain glass)


As comparison :

Nacra inter 17 + spi + fok = 12.500 + 1450 + 899 = 14850 Euro's
Hobie FX-one = was 14.500 (from memory) last year and I think that was without a jib kit.

So the Blade does actually come out well.





We started first in USA (but only by a little) that is true, but don't think that the EU is small in numbers.

I think the US has about 40 F16's now (excl. the 11 Alter cup boats that will be produced in the next 6 months). But by feb 2007 there will be 50 of them. The EU currently has just over 50 boats right now. We currently have 7 Blades in Europe and we'll have 10 before september 2007 because of a new shipment.

Currently in the World we have just over 150 boats now. The largest fleet is Singapore with 25 boats in one single place (and club). Australia is quickly catching up now, after being the tail ender for a while.

So yes it is true we started first in USA, but very quickly we started in other area's in the world as well and they have grown simultaniously.


Anyway, we will mull over your suggestions and probably start contacting some of the Euro dealers to seee what deal we can get.

Many thanks again!!

Wouter-

Once I'm done with weight watchers to lose a few extra pounds that creeped up while I wasn't looking, our combined crew weight is probably about 285 lbs (those stupid U.S. weights - they are really block heads for not going metric!!), i.e. about 130kg.

I see there IS a substantial price difference between the Taipan F-16 and the rest (but what's another 1,000 Euros anyway...). I assume I have to add another 10-20% in VAT, depending on which country I purchase the boat from??

Also, I looked at a Blade recently---what is that crappy-looking seam on the top of the hulls? It looks awful--do the others have that too? I only saw a similar such seam (but much thinner) on the Bimare F-18HT which made it look flimsy. It looked to me like one of those cheap plastic toys that split open on just that seam when you step on them. What gives?

Oh yeah, Wouter-- since we will be sailing this boat totally recreationally and for fun, why join a German (or any other) class association?

Those guys are probably WAY too uptight for me, LOL!!

CatWoman,
Wouter speaks a lot of sense. But as the above-mentioned Spitfire sailor in his reply, I must add that I love my Spitfire too!

I was comparing its one class design nature to the F18s, which have evolved. If you buy any current cat, whether it has the latest sail shape or not, you can bet that when it comes to re-selling in a few years time, your sailplan will be out of date. It is arguable that it will be less out of date in a one class design such as a Spitfire... And if you are not planning to re-sell and to sail recreationally, are you bothered about a few percent in speed? I thought not!

As a Spitfire sailor, I would think you need to pay most attention to any desire to sail solo - the Spitfire is a two-up design that I would sail solo in light-moderate winds but not race it solo in strong winds.

Have fun
Simon

Well, we have three Stealth's at my club and all are different. And they're all of a relatively similar age. Newer boats are even more different. It isn't easy to explain to the guy that runs our results program why they have two different handicaps!

Nice overall weight, all options are well suited to you then. If you were much heavier combined then the newer boats would be better as they have more volume in the hulls, but at 130 kg you are nowhere near any threshold.




Yep but for that you do get the Kevlar hull construction. I case somebody takes a shot at you then you can put the hull between you and him and survive the attack. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />




No, this was already included in the quotes I gave you.




It comes from the "two halves" construction method that nearly all new designs are using in the larger catamaran scene. The seams may look different on different makes but often the seam is there. If not then you have glued on decks what other people think looks crappy. Can't satisfy everyone !


Wouter

Catwoman--I sent you a private message with my phone # if you want to discuss further...not that Wouter hasn't covered everthing <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />