I have had a hobie wave several years and would like to move up a step in performance. I am in my early 50's, weigh about 215 lbs, usually sail solo on an inland lake, and do not race--just like to tool around. The Hobie Getaway and 17 seem a little big for a single person to right. On paper, the Nacra 450 looks about the right size. Nearest Nacra dealer is 10 hrs away, so I'm concerned about getting repairs. (Hobie dealer is 3 hrs away.) Anybody have any feedback on Nacras regarding reliability? Anybody with a 450 have any comments on performance and stability? Any other suggestions? Thanks
I do not know if you are planning to buy a new one or a used one. If you are planning on a new one you make just consider getting a used Formula 16 instead. You do not have to sail it with a chute or even a jib and it is very easy for one person to right. I think that Rick has an ad for one at less than $9000.
A Nacra 500 performs about how a Hobie 16 does. I was just involved with a youth multihull clinic. We had a couple of Nacra 500s about 6 Hobie 16s and an SL16. I would guess that the 450 being about 2 feet shorter would perform more along the lines of a Hobie 14. I would say that is just barely a step above the wave.
What are you trying to accoplish with this purchase? For tooling around the Wave is a good boat. For more performance, non-racing of course, then...?
Another easily righted boat would be an A-Cat. Sometimes you can find them for under $10K and that is a ride!
The wave looks fun and with the Hooter it could be a blast. Isn't that wave a little slower than the 14? I bet with the hooter you would be smoking them and other small cats.
Once you go cat you never go back!
Nacra 5.2 (Elsies)#1499, running an inter17 spin!
Re: nacra 450 vs hobie
[Re: mikewi]
#95581 01/10/0701:30 AM01/10/0701:30 AM
The nacra 450 is too small for you. Instead, look at the nacra 500 (or nacra 5.0) or even a hobie 16; you could still right either. The nacra 450 hulls have less volume than the Wave (they're longer but narrow).
Eric Poulsen A-class USA 203 Ultimate 20 Central California
Re: nacra 450 vs hobie
[Re: mikewi]
#95582 01/10/0702:47 AM01/10/0702:47 AM
I would put a roller-furling Hooter on the Wave. It makes it a whole different boat in the lighter winds that predominate on a lot of lakes in the summer. I would also install a traveler track for the mainsail, and add the optional trapeze (just for fun in heavier air). <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Re: nacra 450 vs hobie
[Re: Mary]
#95583 01/10/0703:26 AM01/10/0703:26 AM
Well, the Hobie 17 is probably heavier to move around and harder to right and takes a lot longer to rig than a Wave.
Plus, I don't know where he sails, but if it is on United States midwest or northeast inland lakes, summers have notoriously light wind, and ANY boat is going to be slow and boring. If that is the case, he is going to want a hooter on the Hobie 17, too.
Plus, his weight won't particularly affect boat performance with the Wave, whereas it probably will with the Hobie 17, which has a lot less buoyancy.
And at his age, the Hobie 17 might be a little more athletic than he wants -- is he going to want to trapeze off the wing if it is windy? Especially when he is solo sailing and probably pretty much alone out there on the lake as far as other sailors watching out for him?
On the other hand, in lighter air, the wing is more comfortable seating for us older folks -- I have thought about putting some kind of lawn chair on my Wave. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
Last edited by Mary; 01/10/0703:59 AM.
Re: nacra 450 vs hobie
[Re: mikewi]
#95585 01/10/0704:54 AM01/10/0704:54 AM
All three ARE RIGHTABLE under the right conditions. At 215 the 4.5 will be the only one of the three you could right in all conditions without the use of a bag.
The 450 is also bullet proof and most of the parts are ronstan (readily available and cheaper then Hobie) and it’s simple to repair fiberglass. The 450 like the 5.0 both have very good handling characteristics.
The Gateway is the slowest of the three and made from plastic similar to the wave so it’s also the heaviest of the three as well. Advantage of plastic being impact resistance and not weight and speed.
The H17 is the fastest and most powerful of the three and uses center boards so will tack/ turn easier but you’ll need to bring along a righting bag as it’s heavier with a longer mast then the 4.5 (the N5.0 is actually lighter then the H17).
Buoyancy wise the 450 was approved in AUS for up to four persons. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
Quote
I have had a hobie wave several years and would like to move up a step in performance. I am in my early 50's, weigh about 215 lbs, usually sail solo on an inland lake, and do not race--just like to tool around. The Hobie Getaway and 17 seem a little big for a single person to right. On paper, the Nacra 450 looks about the right size. Nearest Nacra dealer is 10 hrs away, so I'm concerned about getting repairs. (Hobie dealer is 3 hrs away.) Anybody have any feedback on Nacras regarding reliability? Anybody with a 450 have any comments on performance and stability? Any other suggestions? Thanks
"House prices have risen by nearly 25 percent over the past two years. Although speculative activity has increased in some areas, at a national level these price increases largely reflect strong economic fundamentals." – Ben Bernanke – 2005
Re: nacra 450 vs hobie
[Re: mikewi]
#95586 01/10/0710:33 AM01/10/0710:33 AM
Here's two that nobody has mentioned, but I've always thought about for just your purpose (single handed fun sailing):
Taipan 4.9 uni Nacra/Inter 17, regular or R
Both boats have a great level of performance for the single handing sailor. Both boats can handle taking an extra person along for a ride. Both boats have the option of using a spinnaker when you're ready to try that (believe me, once you do you'll be hooked).
Nacras are pretty darn reliable. Most things you may need a dealer replacement for could be shipped to you.
Thanks for all the replies, it's appreciated. When I compare the 450 to the Wave I see a boat that is 2 ft longer, 1 ft wider, weighs 280 lbs vs. 245, has jib blocks on the front beam instead of the tramp, and a portsmouth rating of 77.5 vs 93.4. A big jump for not much weight or size. The 500 is another 2 ft longer, and weighs 340 lbs. The Getaway is 390 lbs. I do remember a post by Danno where he had a leak in a hull on his 450. That concerns me. The rotomolded hulls on the Hobie have been darn near torpedo proof. I do wonder how much less bouyant the 450 is. On my lake there are some lowrider 16's when 2 good size adults are aboard. BTW another poster mentioned NACRA's "uninspiring" website. Amen to that! Thanks to everyone for your input.
Re: nacra 450 vs hobie
[Re: mikewi]
#95589 01/11/0711:49 AM01/11/0711:49 AM
We had a fellow in our club racing a 500 - very nice little boat, and worked very well for him both single and double handed. I would tend to try to go as large as you can and still be comfortable with moving it around.
Out of the boats I've had, the NACRA hulls have been the best.
The Dart 16 X versions looks alot more modern and it probably a quite pleasant and performant beach cat.
The pricing is very acceptable as well, as so far I can compare them to EU pricing for nacra's and hobie.
I think this Dart 16 X-version should have been the youth boat over the SL16 if ISAF had actually followed their own design goals as defined during the youth selection proces. The difference with the SL16 ? Rotomolded hulls.
Wouter
Last edited by Wouter; 01/11/0702:26 PM.
Wouter Hijink Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild) The Netherlands
The Dart 16 X versions looks alot more modern and it probably a quite pleasant and performant beach cat.
The pricing is very acceptable as well, as so far I can compare them to EU pricing for nacra's and hobie.
Wouter
I suspect the Dart 16X is Laser's knee-jerk response to the announcement from Topper of the new Topaz 16C, designed by Yves Loday and Rob White, which coincidentally is also available in two versions of similar spec to the two Darts. Surprise, surprise! They're the 16C and 16CX! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />
The main difference is that the 16C looks more modern and is claimed to be nearly as fast as a Spitfire according to one of the salespeople on the Topper stand at the London Boat Show.
The fast version is the one in the background.
John Alani ___________ Stealth F16s GBR527 and GBR538
I think 340lbs for the Nacra 5.0 might be an overestimate, I have heard that they are more like 320. The Nacra feels very lively when sailing and is much stiffer than a getaway. These other roto boats may have improved.