Now that I've added a spinnaker to my boat, I'm getting experienced with the joys of many yards of lines all over the deck. So I'm working on ideas for controlling the chaos. The obvious first step is to reduce the lengths of the lines to just what is needed. However.



For the halyard, I rigged the one-line system that sets the tack and head with one line - it works great! But the halyard is rather long once the sail is up, and we've already had a race or two blown by having to undo some severe rat's nests before the sail can be doused. With practice and procedure change this has been reduced, but...



I keep thinking of ways to implement some device that sucks up the halyard out of the way, and will pay it back to me un-knotted when it's time to douse. I was dreaming up all sorts of pulleys and shock-cords and things. And then...



I was looking through one of my recent issues of Sailing World, reading the article on the Javelin B, fantasizing about that wonderful day when I find out that the Easter Bunny really exists and I can buy a new boat. Low and behold, there's mention of a retractable dog leash being used to suck up the tail of the spin halyard!



Eureka! Can it really be that easy? So, my question to the world - can anybody give me any info on doing this? I'll take any hints before I run off to PetsMart for my latest marine experiment. Currently my halyard is 1/4", is that too thick? Any brands that seem to work better than others? At least in this case I can truly say that I'm not going to the boat store...

well, I can't speak as expert on spin handling systems, but on the subject of retractable dog leashes, I'm THE MAN.



No brand names have ever stuck with me, but you certainly get what you pay for with these things. there can be a remarkable difference in quality for that unit that's $5 more expensive.



stay clear of the kind that have their own 25' cord, it'll be useless to you. the cord is springy as heck, and the clutch mechanism won't hold up for very long.



look for the "big dog" variety that use the 3/4" webstrapping as the leash material. these have durable clutches, and you'll have the spool capacity and recoil spring strength you'll need for your halyard. before busting it apart to remove the webstrap and coil your halyard, buy yourself a cheapo tape measure and take IT apart first. you'll be better prepared when the spring flies across the room.



also pay attention to the clutch button mechanism. they each seem to have their own take on it, and some of them are just awful. you obviously won't want something that releases simply by bumping it.



unless this is something you want to get done this weekend, you can probably get a better price online than you would at petsmart. go to petsmart to play with them and figure out which one you want, then go to the dr foster and smith website to get a better deal.

Hi Keith



Greg Scace probably has exactly what you need. He built one for his T before moving to the guck snuffer and I am sure you could get it for a good price... He may even have his spare without modifications. He will be back in town after Cork if you can hold off for a bit. (next weekend)



I use a 1 to 2 halyard on the hoist. and a seperate tack line. This means that you have about 14 feet of line for each on the boat. We have not had any trouble with the halyard snaging on the drops.... the tack line is a bit dicey though... If I remember to toss if off the boat things seem to work well.



Take Care

Mark

The single line method really works nice - I'm going to stick with that. The lines aren't hanging up in the blocks or anything, what was happening was when I tossed the halyard off the boat it immediately tied itself into the world's biggest and worst knot being dragged through the water. We'd then have to bring it back on board and clear it before the spin could come down. The line is 1/4" Yale light, which is normally kind of tangle resistant, and there's probably about 15-18 feet of it when the spin's up. Now we're very carefully coiling it and paying it off the boat very carefully. This helps, but I hate the time and care it takes. Your 1 to 2 halyard sounds interesting, maybe there's something there that can help reduce the amount of line as well.



The idea of something just sucking it up whilst the sail is raised is particularly enticing. I'll have to check with Greg. Of course, being a tinkerer I'll probably be looking around the pet store this weekend...

I have the same "big dog" leash that Randy Smyth was using on his F18HT (but I actually use it for my big dog). It is made by "Standard" and is a Flexi3-5 model and I bought it at Wal-Mart a while back. Although it claims to hold 16feet of line the line that comes in it is a bit small at 1/16". I haven't taken it apart but it looks like it will accept something up to a 1/8" halyard. I also don't think the springs or the screws will hold up to extended saltwater exposure but at $12 or so who cares?

Howdy Keith,



Spinnakers are great fun hey. I have a combined tack line and spinnaker halyard on my Tornado but use a shoot that is sewn diagnally under my tramp with the mouth in the front port corner of the tramp. Great system and very user frendly. Less windage than a bag or pole shoot and realy cleans up the deck. I retreive from 2 points but on smaller tramps try 3 points. This system you do not have any excess halyard.



If you want to stick with the bag, tie the tail of the halyard to the head of the kite and the excess will go up the mast and not out the back.



Question for all you guys. The halyard is technicaly part of the boat so if it is draging behind do other boats have to stay clear. And what happens when you gybe at a mark and the halyard hits the mark. Do you do a 360 turn??????



Regards

Stephen Medwell

www.tornadoalive.com

Stephen,

Thanks for the reply. I'm not sure I understand %100 of what you are describing. One problem with the H-18 is a lack of freeboard/clearance under the tramp, so I think for me putting something underneath is not an option.



I'm trying to understand the idea of the tying the tail of the halyard to the head of the sail - it sounds intrigueing but I'm not sure how tangles would be avoided. Any hints? Sounds like a clean solution, further explanaiton would be great.



The halyard trailing the boat I believe is part of the boat, so what you described would be true. I was in a port-starboard situation coming into a mark, and had to pull the line in to avoid "hitting" the starboard boat - at least it seemed like I'd be at fault.



What I'm about to try is this - After looking a dog leashes a bit, and not having any concrete advice to work with yet, I happened to find a retractable clothesline at Home Depot. Very easy to swap the line - I drilled two holes in the top - one to lock the reel and the other allow access to the knot on the captive end. I've done some playing with off the boat, and it seems to fairly reliably suck up about 20 feet of 1/4" line. It cost $14. I haven't tried it on the boat yet, it may not be a long-lasting solution.

Hi Keith,



The sock only hangs down about 100mm at the front and gets allot thinner as

it gets to the back. We use a 49 sock on our boat with an anodised alloy

ring at the mouth cut in the tramp.



See the attached



spi.conv.01 - shows the sock under the tramp

spi.conv.09 - shows the alloy ring (sock mouth) front port corner of tramp.



The sock has zippers one each side that are sewn on so we car remove it for

repairs. Just behind the ring we have velcro sticking the sock to the

tramp. The sock is silicone coated spinnaker material as is the spinnaker

so it slides in and out easier.



Our sock was developed by John Forbes and Darren Bundock and fitted by Red

Head Sails in Gosford NSW Australia.



A secret to the sock is if it is too tight it will be hard to retrieve and

if it is too loose it will gather water, so you may have to experiment.



Another option would be a sock that runs from just in front of the bridle

mounted on a hoop to just under the front beam. See pic of F-18 at

http://www.kcc.ozehosting.com.au/Photos/F18_Billy_Buster_09-2002.jpg



With regard to tying the tail of the halyard to the head of the kite, when

you pull in halyard the kite head goes up to the top of the mast and the

excess halyard follows. Same principle as the retrieval line/halyard tail

going up to the centre of the kite. It just dose not have to run to the

back of a sock, through and out the other end to the middle of the kite.



I have not tried this on my boat as I went straight to a sock but other

kites at my club did before they went to a sock and found it worked great.

The sock however, I find the best method.



Regards

Stephen Medwell.

Team Tornado 'ALIVE'

www.tornadoalive.com

Stephen,



How do you set your spinnaker on a port tack? Is there another opening on the starboard front corner?



You are using a very interesting idea which I'm sure certainly helps keep the tramp clean, but I like to do a lot of distance racing so I need to be able to set from both tacks.



One question I do have is how have you attached your spinnaker halyard? I currently just steal a downhaul cleat and run my haylard through there. I have seen that the I-20's spi haylard runs down to the front beam via a block then to a cleat. Any opinions? I'd like to have my downhaul back!



Thanks,

Steve.

Try the tornado new rig photo page for ideas...



http://www.tornado.tc/nrp.htm

supprisingly we do not have much trouble hoisting or droping the kite on a port tack. May take a second or two longer but still very quick. The squarer you run whilst doing this, the easier it is.



When droping on port tack, the skipper can pull in the lazy spinnaker sheet with his spare hand to speed up the drop.



If you do fit this system, with a bit of practice while on a port tack, you will work out a system that will suit you best.



The spinnaker halyard is cleated through a swivel cleat positioned on the starbord side of the mast at about sholder level when you are kneeling on one knee on the tramp.



The cleat should be positioned so you release by pulling in the downward direction. We have made a plate up a placed a second cleat in front of the cleat on the swivel bracket (ie make a flat plate - drill 4 holes in it so 2 cleats can be bolted on, one in front of the other and bolt this on to the swivel bracket using the bolts that secure the rear cleat) We have done this because we found that 1 cleat just would not hold the pressure of the halyard.



Regards

Stephen

Stephen,



I have had the spinnaker haylard come out with one cleat, but it was because of the angle going into the block was too high. Sounds like you have a straight shot and it still pulled - wow.



Based on the I-20 design where there is a block mounted to the front beam which then goes to a cleat on the front beam, I have added a block tied to a line then secured to the dolphin striker. I'm thinking that this will still allow the line to come down the mast then through the block and to the cleat on the font beam. If I can't get this to work, then I will just rivot on a swivel cleat above the downhaul blocks and run it from there. The only real problem I have with this is that there is an extra block swiging on the mast when I'm not using the spinnaker.



Steve

P19+spi 969