I think it is time to shut the old forum down. The personal attacks on good people or classes is not helping anyone. Let someone else set up a site for trash talk. You wonder why the monohull classes want to keep us out of some regattas? It is not just that cats are faster....we harbor some vulgar people. Show respect for the sport.

After reading your post I visited the "old forum" for the first time in quite awhile. I detest what goes on there. At least on this forum you know someone can be traced. I have refused to allow my goddaughter to go on that site because of whats there on a daily basis. Her mother refused to let her come near me for awhile because of what she read on that site while using my computer. I'm all for freedom of speech!!! What I'm not for is the lies, foul language, agendas, being misquoted, etc. that goes on there. I won't be going back on the old forum again...its never going to change...thats apparent!!!



thommerrill

F25c 009

ARC22 #2234

FMS SC20 #57

Add my vote to those who would like to shut the old forum down. In the response to the question in the polling booth, 60% of voters said that they would continue to visit catsailor.com and 26% said that they would come to the site more often. There were 23% who said they would no longer come to the site, but if they are the ones that are responsible for the embarrasingly rude behavior on the old forum, let them be gone.



I've found the new forum to be friendly, encouraging and helpful. It is only because of this new forum that I've continued to visit the catsailor site. Thanks.

I'm on the Fboat forum everyday and I have never seen the thrash that occurs on the old forum. For the past two years I have only seen geniune posts and responses coming from the members. There are disagreements [sometimes harsh /no foul language is allowed] but the members know who each other are talking to as well can address them publicly or personally via their email. Its has advertising but so does this site. The moderator does an excellent job keeping all members up to speed as to what that site is for. The old forum is unnecessary to anyone that doesn't mind using their real name. Almost every post on the Fboat site has the full name as well as what boats they sail as well as who they work for if applicable.



thommerrill

F25c #009

ARC22 #2234

FMS SC 20 #57

One comment / question, I have seen some anon posts on this board. Can that be eliminated altogether?

If someone signs on to the new forum but does not allow their name or e-mail to show, they are in essence, anonymous. I guess Rick as moderator could look at who they are but nobody else can. When the nasty slobs from the open forum (and I think it is only 2 or 3 people) find out, they will come here to spread their poison.



Rick, can you REQUIRE that names show?

there you go? Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about is the old saying...

YOu are correct about the admin of the program. We can delete posts, track who is saying it, and other things. There is nothing wrong with having a "handle" and have you noticed there is little, if any, flaming and slamming on this New Forum.

Some of the Forums here do allow non-registered posting, i.e., Results, NORs and stuff like that. Again, we can control all of that. The program has a very good backside for administration.

One of the neat things is that if a given User posts something offensive, we can delete it and then notify that poster to not do it again.

If the User should persist we could simply bar that User from any more postings.



While the goal is to allow freedom of speech, we feel that freedom of speech with responsibility is very important.

Thanks

Rick

I beg to differ.



The 'old forum' is far more interesting than the new one, sorry. I don't see postings from guys like Bill Roberts or WF Oliver over here. F'rinstance, have a look at the recent post re: Coyote Square (ok, I'm biased).



The bashing's shitty, but it's real easy to NOT CLICK ON the link, and dang, if you just have to read it, DON'T ANSWER IT. (gotta love ya, Wouter... ;-)



G.Zeus, it ain't rocket science...



sea ya

tami

Hi Rick,



As an administrator, your posts/questions re: the old forum suggest that you see a possible upside in retaining the dialogue on the old forum, especially (I infer) if shutting it down will cause that lively discussion to move elsewhere. Yet you say the old forum is a headache to maintain.



Why not create a new "old forum" on this platform, with the same anonymous privileges now extant on the "old forum" - (except you will be able to find out who the truely egregious violators are.) Let it remain as ... er... freeform as it is now, and use the "forum description" to advise about the content. You could even switch on the "I am over 18" checkbox, to provide an additional fig leaf.



Import the last 5 threads on the old forum, using cut'n paste methods, since 20 posts doesn't justify paying for an import.



You're all done. Best 'o both worlds for you and for the hardcore (no pun intended) "old forumers"!

Tami,

When the new forum opened up it seemed that there was a lot of resistance from those who had regularly used the "old" forum. It seems that the two forums have evolved in different directions. The new forum has become, in my view, the place where new sailors (along with those new to catsailor.com) are attracted. The discussions on this forum have names (and, in many cases, faces). There is a genuine attitude of support and respect. The old forum has, in my view, become further entrenched in an attitude of arrogance and flaming, anonymous posts. It is unfortunate that it also remains the place where many of the top ranked sailors choose to participate. Those of us who prefer the "new" forum do not gain from their input. More significantly, however, is the way that those sailors can become labeled with the same negative stereotypes as the anonymous flamers that frequent the site.

Perhaps Roberts posts on the old forum, but this forum by far offers more information to sailors.

You really have to search on the old one to get any good conversations.., it's mostly just whining or complaining.

Perhaps that is what we ought to name it: "Complaint Dept." instead of "Old Forum."

Rick

Roberts posted several times about the Pro Formula 22 Circuit. Other quite knowledgeable sailors post on this site as well.



Also your comment about not opening a post is bogus because you never know what you're going to see when you open one up. Just look at your last post as an example.



thommerrill

F25c 009

ARC22 2234

FMS SC20 57

I'd have to say that the regular visitors to CatSailor can spot a bogus post when they see it, whether it is on the old forum or new. The problem is when a new visitor comes to the forum looking and has to sift through all the idiocy.

In my opinion, it makes the sport look bad.

What do you mean, 'my last post?'

tami I think its the choice of the four letter functional words your using.

I still visit the old forum just to see if there is anything usefull there from time to time because you're right, there are two different groups that seem to use one forum but not the other. However, Kevin makes a good point that a lot of new folks post on that forum first and they don't get the kind of answers they could get here. I say let's do away with the old forum. The most usefull posters will likely migrate here and those with the biggest beef will either try to trash this one (but they can be deterred) or go away.

Catman,



while I appreciate your insight, I expect Mr. Merrill should answer for himself, since he made the remark.



Besides, if what you suggest is correct, I expect Mr. Merrill should cloister himself, as far worse expressions than mine are regularly used as script on television. Even PTV, it must be said...



sea ya

tami

I help run a giagantic website geared specifically at college students. As you could expect, we had huge problems in our forums with people just posting mindless drivel, ruthless personal attacks, and other unmentionables. Our solution? We created a space for all the children to play together and just left it alone. All the links to that certain area are clearly marked "enter at your own risk." While there is absolutely NO value whatsoever to be found in that particular section of the forums, it does effectively keep the crap out of the other forums so constructive conversation can continue. In many ways I see this "old forum" serving the same function, unfortunately, its those people who we should be looking towards for quality information that are the centers of the elementary name-calling. I don't think you should shut down the old forum Rick, the lack of suitable "playground area" might force the kids that can't get along with other to come over here.

I like that idea and will see if I can get it labeled in such a way.

And yesterday I modified the sites main template. Now Open Forum on the masthead takes you here. Before, in the same spot, was Old Forum. I moved that to the left-hand index under Forums in general.

Meanwhile, that opened up space to put our Great Links link on the masthead (where it really needed to be since there are around 3000 links in total and there are many good ones.)

So, when a new sailor comes aboard, the traffic will mostly be directed to this Forum by default.

Thanks,

Rick