| US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll #134897 03/06/08 01:29 AM 03/06/08 01:29 AM |
Joined: Jul 2001 Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC Tornado OP
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Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC | Based on the position that US Sailing took in the 2012 Olympic Equipement Selection, which resulted in the Multihull removal, are you going to renew your US Sailing membership this year?
Yes |
35%, 27 Votes
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No |
65%, 51 Votes
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Last edited by Tornado; 03/06/08 01:35 AM.
| | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: Tornado]
#134898 03/06/08 01:50 AM 03/06/08 01:50 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 3,293 Long Beach, California John Williams
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Posts: 3,293 Long Beach, California | Mike, I suggest you rephrase for accuracy:
Based on the position that the Olympic Sailing Committee took in the 2012 Olympic Events Selection, which ranked the chances of a US medal in the multihull lower than in the keelboat, are you going to renew your US Sailing membership this year?
People are still working to make it right. Quitting guarantees nothing will change.
John Williams
- The harder you practice, the luckier you get - Gary Player, pro golfer
After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
| | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: John Williams]
#134899 03/06/08 06:24 AM 03/06/08 06:24 AM |
Joined: Apr 2006 Posts: 699 SE Pa. or Chesapeak Bay HMurphey
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Posts: 699 SE Pa. or Chesapeak Bay | Gentlemen,
Please Remember the Second Rule of Diplomcy: In Order to be able to effect the outcome of any negotiation first you have to be at the "table" envolved in the process of negotiating.
I just spoke to "Kate" on Monday at US Sailing, she is in-charge the Membership/Renewals. Really nice lady ... so be nice .... But ... CALL HER ... Make YOUR position known to the leadership of US Sailing!!! Our $$$$s' and membership numbers do mean/count for something! When she is able to go to her boss and say " I have ALOT of Multihullers calling and telling me that they are very displeased w/ our leadership here at US Sailing, they are all renewing their memberships, and there's alot of them, saying that; We, the multihullers are out here participating in racing sailboats, and we are coming for you, the leadership .... and we WILL make our presence known".
See our numbers .... now hear us ROOOAAAAR ...
I am going to a US SAiling Race Management Seminar at the end of March at Miles River YC. I WILL be wearing my LOUDEST BRIGHTEST Catamaran Regetta Event Shirt and I will make my presense known to the US Sailing Representatives there.
I AM A MULTIHULLER ... IGNORE ME AT YOUR OWN PERIL!!!
HarryMurphey H18mag/#9458, Fleet54/Div11 P19mx w/spin, /#86, CRAC | | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: John Williams]
#134900 03/06/08 07:46 AM 03/06/08 07:46 AM | Anonymous
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Unregistered | John, I don't think this quite represents the whole situation. First, based on the public statements of Jim Capron and Dean Brenner, I believe this really was a US Sailing position, not just the Olympic Committee position.
But more importantly in my mind, based on explicit statements made by the US Sailing treasurer Leslie Keller, the decision was not simply about what events were most likely to yield medals on the basis of the US's actual competitiveness in those events. It was based on what US team composition they thought would be more likely to attract the greatest amount of money in donations from the sailing community at large and thus provide them with the greatest budget with which to prepare the team to compete effectively. | | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: HMurphey]
#134901 03/06/08 07:50 AM 03/06/08 07:50 AM | Anonymous
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Unregistered | That's a great idea. I'm going to the same seminar at the Milwaukee YC the week after yours. I will make sure I wear something appropriate. | | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: mbounds]
#134905 03/06/08 09:34 AM 03/06/08 09:34 AM |
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 216 Lakewood, Colorado MUST429
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Posts: 216 Lakewood, Colorado | Good on both of you for participating in these classes. The more we show our face, the less they'll be able to ignore us. Matt, How about a link to the schedule for these seminar's? Maybe some of the rest of us could attend the seminar's in our respective area's and re-enforce the "message" PLUS, a race management seminar is a great way to invest one's time. I attended one sponsored by Hobie, and taught by PU. I learned a lot, and gained some insight as to how PU runs an event. Made sailing in a regatta where he was the PRO much more enjoyable for me. Stephen H-18
Life is not about waiting for the storms to pass... It's about learning to dance in the rain
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[Re: MUST429]
#134906 03/06/08 10:04 AM 03/06/08 10:04 AM |
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 1,884 Detroit, MI mbounds
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Posts: 1,884 Detroit, MI | The seminars are listed on US SAILING's calendar on their web site. Here's a direct link: US SAILING Race Management SeminarsThe best time to take these is in the winter. I did the Advanced RM seminar in January, taught by Tom Farquhar (the guy who literally wrote the book) at the St. Pete YC. I know Mike Levesque just took the ARM seminar last weekend taught by Peter Reggio - he's the guy that runs the signal boat at a little event called "The America's Cup". | | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: HMurphey]
#134907 03/06/08 11:04 AM 03/06/08 11:04 AM |
Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 297 rexdenton
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Posts: 297 | So the decision is based on the premius that "we can buy the medals"??? More or less accurate. The voting was done, not to advance the interest in yachting, but rather, based on medal chances and representation within US Sailing. That said, every rep in the world more or less acted the same way. Therein lies the problem. The whole weakness of the current system is an inadequate ISAF vision for the youth boat selection to building interest in the sport of yachting. The system of placing 'Olympic Chances' before skill, excitement and sheer athleticism guarantees that the the international governance organizations will resort to voting for equipment with which they are most familiar or have a personal interest. In doing so, the current process takes a short view of the sport in spite of the future, as well as thumbing their nose at guidance by the IOC for coming up with a more exciting event; the selections made do little to appeal to a bigger, general Olympic spectator audience. By analogy, in Olympic Skiing they went through a similar evolution with the Snowboard, and short track skating. However, for those sports, ultimately there was recognition that the new approaches were athletic, accessible, people liked doing it, watching it, and participating in the competition. Its hard to imagine anyone (other than the participants themselves) being captivated by a keelboat dual, let alone **two** of them in the Olympics. Furthermore, given the esoteric nature of some of the selection of moribund boat classes, a suspension of disbelief will be required (by Joe Average Olympic watcher) to understand how yachting can be 'interesting or accessible'. That's why the ISAF should have re-focused on team activites, speed and athleticism, rather than 'doing a vote'- No vision.
Nacra F18 #856
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[Re: ]
#134910 03/06/08 11:20 AM 03/06/08 11:20 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 3,293 Long Beach, California John Williams
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Posts: 3,293 Long Beach, California | Hi Mark -
I agree that there have certainly been other justifications and rationales offered up in the last year regarding how decisions were made on this issue. However, at the very core, the center, the Genesis, this began with one or two individuals looking at the respective fleets and estimating the US chances of winning medals. If you think, as I do, that the reasoning was flawed, then everything that follows is irrelevant. Additional discussion regarding fundraising has been taking place, of course, though I feel it is a red herring - the premise that keelboaters will only donate to the Olympics if there is a keelboat event and that multihull sailors do not donate is (I'm sorry to be blunt) silly. If fundraisers don't capitalize on our most recent medal wins when appealing for donations, then they are missing an opportunity. Further, they now have the protracted "keelboat v. multihull" conflict to resolve - no matter who wins, someone loses and the motivations are now percieved to be something less than altruistic with regard to the health of the sport. That becomes particularly problematic during a period of stated "focus on building membership."
Which brings us to a poll like this one. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
John Williams
- The harder you practice, the luckier you get - Gary Player, pro golfer
After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
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[Re: rexdenton]
#134911 03/06/08 11:40 AM 03/06/08 11:40 AM |
Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 291 JACKFLASH
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Posts: 291 | So the decision is based on the premius that "we can buy the medals"??? More or less accurate. The voting was done, not to advance the interest in yachting, but rather, based on medal chances and representation within US Sailing. If that is the case, why doesn't John Lovell/Charlie Ogletree's Silver carry any weight. I mean it seems to me that if we took silver on the Tornado at the last Olypics, are our chances to medal not better than say in an event where we did not medal in the past Olympics? Why can't they just add another event? I'm guessing the answer there is money. Heaven forbid we cut out an ice skating event or gymnastics event. Collin
Collin Casey Infusion Platform + C2 rig and rags = one fast cookie
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[Re: John Williams]
#134913 03/06/08 11:54 AM 03/06/08 11:54 AM | Anonymous
Unregistered
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Unregistered | John, whether the premise you mention is silly or not I don't know - I just don't know enough about the sailing culture in the US to say. All I can tell you is what Leslie told me directly was behind the decision, which is what I've related here and in the past. If credible, I think it underscores the magnitude of the hurdle multihull sailors have to overcome to be treated equitably by US Sailing.
Mark. | | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: ]
#134914 03/06/08 12:13 PM 03/06/08 12:13 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 3,293 Long Beach, California John Williams
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Posts: 3,293 Long Beach, California | Leslie is being honest with you about the reasons that were given by the Olympic Sailing Committee to the Board of Directors when they were considering the matter some 12 or 15 months ago. My assertion is that the matter of funding is "silly" because it is a rationale tailored to support a decision that was based on an altogether different line of reasoning. The biggest hurdle for multihull sailors is that too few of us are involved in the management of the sport - I expect that is because most of us would rather be out engaging in the sport rather than inside talking about it.
John Williams
- The harder you practice, the luckier you get - Gary Player, pro golfer
After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
| | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: John Williams]
#134915 03/06/08 12:16 PM 03/06/08 12:16 PM |
Joined: Jul 2001 Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC Tornado OP
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Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC | Mike, I suggest you rephrase for accuracy:
Based on the position that the Olympic Sailing Committee took in the 2012 Olympic Events Selection, which ranked the chances of a US medal in the multihull lower than in the keelboat, are you going to renew your US Sailing membership this year?
People are still working to make it right. Quitting guarantees nothing will change. John, thanks for your comment. I am, perhaps like other people, a bit confused as to what the "Olympic Selection Committee" is and what it's relatonship to US Sailing is. From what I recall reading, is was US Sailing's position to get the Multi's out, and there was pressure put on other countries to go along with this. The point of this poll is to gauge how current members will react when asked to send in their yearly renewal. I do agree it may not be a good thing to drop a membership and that it might do more harm than good. But I don't think it guarrantee's nothing will change.
Mike Dobbs Tornado CAN 99 "Full Tilt"
| | | Re: US Sailing Membership Renewal Poll
[Re: mbounds]
#134916 03/06/08 02:35 PM 03/06/08 02:35 PM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | I did the Advanced RM seminar in January, taught by Tom Farquhar (the guy who literally wrote the book) at the St. Pete YC.
I know Mike Levesque just took the ARM seminar last weekend taught by Peter Reggio - he's the guy that runs the signal boat at a little event called "The America's Cup". Hey Matt, You went to Florida AND tracked me down last weekend??? WAAAAAY too much free time, dude! Luigi (Reggio) is great fun. You always learn a lot at these events. The key is, have an open mind. The way you're used to seeing/running regattas isn't the only way, and may not always be the best way... That's the real lesson... Mike | | |
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