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Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics #152105
08/09/08 07:33 PM
08/09/08 07:33 PM
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New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline OP
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I have my own thoughts on this subject and have stated those views to the ITA. What are your thoughts.

Should the Code 0 Gennaker be used in the Tornado Class during the Olympics
single choice
Yes
80%, 75 Votes
No
20%, 19 Votes
Total Votes: 94
Voting on this poll ends: 08/15/08 07:32 PM

Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: windswept] #152106
08/09/08 09:46 PM
08/09/08 09:46 PM
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Looks like measures have outlawed the pelican striker on the spinnaker poles Booth and Lovell developed for the code zero.

http://sailjuiceblog.com/2008/08/08/you-ca...olphin-striker/

[Linked Image]

[quote name='Tornado_ALIVE' date='Aug 10 2008, 12:09 PM' post='1826774']
Though looking at the class rules, I can not see how the pelican striker breaches the class rules.

Rule F.5
Page 22

http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/200...Rules%20190208-[5103].pdf
[/quote]


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152107
08/09/08 09:53 PM
08/09/08 09:53 PM
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I still can't see it.

F.5 BOWSPRIT
F.5.1 MATERIALS
(a) Bowsprit materials are optional.
(b ) Bowsprit spar stay materials are optional.
(c ) Bowsprit-to-forestay extension strut materials are optional.
(d) Gennaker retrieval system materials are optional.
F.5.2 CONSTRUCTION
(a) The forward end of the bowsprit spar shall be plugged or capped, and
blunt.
F.5.3 FITTINGS
(a) MANDATORY
1) Gennaker tack block
2) Stays from the bowsprit spar gennaker tack block position and the
bowsprit mid section to the hulls
3) Attachment point fittings for the jib tack and/or jib luff tension
(b ) OPTIONAL
1) Attachment point fittings for the bowsprit-to-forestay extension strut
and jib sheet.
2) A gennaker retrieval system may be attached to the bowsprit or be
integral to the construction of the bowsprit. It shall be suitable solely for
the purpose containing the gennaker and shall not violate rule D.6.2.d.
F.5.4 DIMENSIONS
minimum maximum
Bowsprit spar diameter 38 mm -
Distance of bearing surface of the gennaker
tack lead from the forward edge of the main
beam, measured with the gennaker halyard
pulled tight and the bowsprit fitted to the boat
in its normal sailing position
4000 mm
F.5.5 WEIGHT
minimum maximum
Bowsprit spar, gennaker retrieval system,
fasteners, tack block, halyard/tack line block,
internal tack line and brace stays
2.2 kg -


Though click on Tornado at the official notices link - http://www.sailing.org/olympics/racing/officialnotices.php and the measuring comittee has sail NO to pelican striker


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152108
08/09/08 10:01 PM
08/09/08 10:01 PM
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Tornado measurment

THURSDAY 7th AUGUST - FRA
SATURDAY 9th AUGUST - AUT, CHN, GRE
SUNDAY 10th AUGUST - ITA, UKR, NED
MONDAY 11th AUGUST - GBR, ESP, GER
TUESDAY 12th AUGUST - USA, BEL, ARG
WEDNESDAY 13th AUGUST - AUS, CAN

Looks like Bundy and Ashby will be able to decide on weather or not to use the code zero after watching everybody else make the call.


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152109
08/09/08 10:33 PM
08/09/08 10:33 PM
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Tornado footage in Athens (When there was wind)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vj5JkAe-ZkI


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152110
08/09/08 11:39 PM
08/09/08 11:39 PM
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Just noticed (Been a little slack) that New Zealand decided not to send a Tornado team despite Aaron McIntosh and Mark Kennedy quailfing NZ in Feb. Only 15 boats at the regatta.

That's poor form form NZ.


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152111
08/10/08 01:23 AM
08/10/08 01:23 AM
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West coast of Norway
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Stephen,

I think the measurers are leaning on "what is not expressively allowed is forbidden" clause. A bit silly in this instance in my opinion.

We discussed this striker earlier, before we knew about the sail to go with it. Did not make sense to me then, but now it does.

Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #152112
08/10/08 02:04 AM
08/10/08 02:04 AM
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Yes, makes you wonder if it would have been banned if they were using conventional spinnakers.


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152113
08/10/08 02:07 AM
08/10/08 02:07 AM
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I dont think so.

Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #152114
08/10/08 06:11 AM
08/10/08 06:11 AM
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Booth has measured in with his code zero.

http://sailjuice.squarespace.com/


Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152115
08/10/08 08:41 AM
08/10/08 08:41 AM
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New Hampshire, USA
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Booth has measured his, Bundock and Ashby have chosen not to measure theirs, we will see what Lovell and Ogletree decide to do. I am having difficulty understanding the pelican striker as an issue.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: windswept] #152116
08/10/08 09:08 AM
08/10/08 09:08 AM
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My guess is that they have binned the pole as the measurer is saying that the pelican striker is part of the pole and so makes the dia > 38mm?

Quote
F.5.4 DIMENSIONS
minimum maximum
Bowsprit spar diameter 38 mm -


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Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: scooby_simon] #152117
08/10/08 10:32 AM
08/10/08 10:32 AM
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After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152118
08/10/08 10:34 AM
08/10/08 10:34 AM
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Quote
Just noticed (Been a little slack) that New Zealand decided not to send a Tornado team despite Aaron McIntosh and Mark Kennedy quailfing NZ in Feb. Only 15 boats at the regatta.

That's poor form form NZ.

I think that the reason behind that was the number of atheletes NZ could send and they ended up being cut from the team for that reason. I may be wrong but that is my interpretation. I friend of mine from canada had a similar incident during one of the previous Olympics in which he made the Olympics only to have the canadian body cut his event from participation. Could you imagine making it that far only to be left home. Much like all of the Olympians from 1980 when carter boycotted the Moscow games. I have a few friends who were on either the Sailing team or the Gymnastics team who are still upset over that one.


Tom Siders
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Tornado US775
Re: Should the Code 0 gennaker be used at the Olympics [Re: windswept] #152119
08/10/08 07:08 PM
08/10/08 07:08 PM
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Imagine the publicity if it turned out all NZ sailors are not old and fat like their commitee and the NZ Tornado team won a medal. I even want the US Tornado team to come second to rub US Sailings nose in it. Perhaps we need the French Rainbow Warrior team to sink some keelboats for us <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.


Jeff Southall
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Re: Aaron and Mark [Re: JeffS] #152120
08/10/08 07:37 PM
08/10/08 07:37 PM

A
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Aaron and Mark never made the team (they weren't cut). The NZ olympic committee has very strict qualification procedures requiring consistent performance at the top level before you get selected (even if you do qualify). Basically you need to be a member of the "team" to be able to afford to compete at all the required international events, but without attending and doing well at these events you can't get into the team. If you don't have money left in your account from an AC campaign or well funded parents, its almost impossible to break in.

Re: Aaron and Mark [Re: ] #152121
08/11/08 05:43 AM
08/11/08 05:43 AM
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Then why did another nation not be given the oportunity to fill the slot NZ decided not to fill.

I am sure the other nations that were on the fringe of qualifying are real pissed off.


Re: Aaron and Mark [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152122
08/11/08 06:03 AM
08/11/08 06:03 AM
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The sailors who would have got the tickets surely are dissapointed, but I dont know if their national association would be dissapointed? Spending more money for a very slim chance of medaling? I dont subscribe to that line of tought, that is not what the olympics are supposed to be about.
How the russian and georgian teams, or the other european teams for that sake, can participate in the olympic games when we have war between two european states dont fit well with what I understand the olympic games to be about either.

Re: Aaron and Mark [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #152123
08/11/08 07:33 AM
08/11/08 07:33 AM
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Quote
Then why did another nation not be given the oportunity to fill the slot NZ decided not to fill.

I am sure the other nations that were on the fringe of qualifying are real pissed off.


Agree there. Forgot what nation it was, but they gave up their Finn spot to India. India hadn't qualified, but now have the opportunity to be at the games and promote sailing the in the country with the 2nd biggest population.

Re: Aaron and Mark [Re: taipanfc] #152124
08/11/08 07:48 AM
08/11/08 07:48 AM
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Top 4 teams that were still to qualify at the NZ Worlds were to take up the remaining 4 slots.

The top 4 teams in order were....
Canada, Austria, New Zealand and the Ukraine

The next 4 teams that were seeking to qualify in order of how they finished at the Worlds......

Russia, Puerto Rico, Brazil, Poland and Venezuela

I believe Booth was seeking a wildcard entry for Puerto Rico, one of the teams (along with the US) that were involved in their code zero training camps. They were denied.


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