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Falcon #165444
01/20/09 03:03 PM
01/20/09 03:03 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,921
Michigan
PTP Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
PTP  Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel

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Michigan
How has there NOT been a discussion of the new Falcon on here? or did I miss it?

BTW... I want to see pics of the rudders.

Last edited by PTP; 01/20/09 03:05 PM.
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Re: Falcon [Re: PTP] #165455
01/20/09 04:02 PM
01/20/09 04:02 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 439
Memphis, TN
M
mikeborden Offline
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Memphis, TN
You know, I wanted to hear about it too!!! smile Any pics?




Viper USA 132

1984 Hobie 18
Re: Falcon [Re: mikeborden] #165462
01/20/09 04:58 PM
01/20/09 04:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,046
Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
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It looks like an Infusion, in that it has rounded topsides foreward of the mast. The tramp is laced up the sides like the new F18's too. Gina said she liked it but it is harder to lay on the hulls up front in light wind as they are round on top. Matt was using the standard Blade rudders but has some other shape coming. Nice looking boat. No, I didn't have a camera.


Blade F16
#777
Re: Falcon [Re: Timbo] #165465
01/20/09 05:33 PM
01/20/09 05:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
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David Ingram  Offline
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I took some pics and sent them to M&G yesterday.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: Falcon [Re: David Ingram] #165472
01/20/09 07:13 PM
01/20/09 07:13 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
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I was wondering what logo that was (3rd sail from the left).
Is it a new design? Who's is it?
[Linked Image]

Re: Falcon [Re: Tony_F18] #165475
01/20/09 07:22 PM
01/20/09 07:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
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It is a new design from Matt McDonald. I'm sure he'll post the pictures soon.



David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: Falcon [Re: Timbo] #165482
01/20/09 08:22 PM
01/20/09 08:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 72
Florida, USA
G
Gina_M Offline
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Florida, USA
Originally Posted by Timbo
Gina said she liked it but it is harder to lay on the hulls up front in light wind as they are round on top.

Nah, Tim, you misunderstood me. If I'm laying on the bow of the boat, then I shouldn't be sailing. We do not like bobbing in light air. As for the bow differences, I have to have my weight more forward vs. toward the back on the Blade in the downwind blows. I like it very much as it seems more stable for Matt and I. I also like how it reaches - again, very stable. Like the Blade, I'll have to get used to the difference in weight positioning - every time I went out on the wire, I ran into Matt. And I can't wait for the lines to get a bit more worn and for them to stay tied. New boats... You'll have to take it for a ride and I'll even crew for you if you promise not to hurt me. Oh, I miss my purple spinnaker too.


Falcon F16 crew
Re: Falcon [Re: Gina_M] #165483
01/20/09 08:34 PM
01/20/09 08:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,921
Michigan
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Carpal Tunnel
PTP  Offline OP
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Michigan
I was hoping the design was a little more friendly in terms of the bows burying. Sounds like it is.
wash the lines in a washing machine... that ought to make them more friendly!

Re: Falcon [Re: PTP] #165505
01/21/09 05:53 AM
01/21/09 05:53 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 404
Chattanooga, TN
Joanna Offline
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Joanna  Offline
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Chattanooga, TN
Boy, am I behind things...SO Matt is making a new F16? the Falcon? Is VW still making the Blade? I would like to see photos too.
See you all at the Invitational in April!!!


Joanna

Blade F16
"Too Sharp to Touch"
Re: Falcon [Re: PTP] #165508
01/21/09 07:08 AM
01/21/09 07:08 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,348
F
fin. Offline
Carpal Tunnel
fin.  Offline
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F

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Posts: 3,348
Originally Posted by PTP
I was hoping the design was a little more friendly in terms of the bows burying. . .


That, my friend, is up to the driver! wink

Re: Falcon [Re: fin.] #165524
01/21/09 09:31 AM
01/21/09 09:31 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 439
Memphis, TN
M
mikeborden Offline
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Ok, this is really exciting and only a little talk?

What's the weight, design differences .......???? smile


I know I'm getting a Viper, but any new F16 boat is great for the class!!!!


Mike wink


Viper USA 132

1984 Hobie 18
Re: Falcon [Re: mikeborden] #165526
01/21/09 09:46 AM
01/21/09 09:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,348
F
fin. Offline
Carpal Tunnel
fin.  Offline
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F

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Posts: 3,348
I only spoke to Matt briefly. The weight is at or near minimum, the rocker is farther forward than the Blade. The obvious visual difference is hull volume. The Falcon seems to have more volume than either the Viper or the Blade. There is a "hump" (saddle?) that the rear cross bar sits in.

I could not tell any difference in performance. M&G rock regardless of the boat they are sailing!

I couldn't tell any difference in the sails, Glasers, but wasn't really looking.

The Falcon uses a high aspect board.


Last edited by Tikipete; 01/21/09 09:48 AM.
Re: Falcon [Re: Joanna] #165541
01/21/09 10:48 AM
01/21/09 10:48 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 548
MERRITTISLAND, FL
Matt M Offline
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Matt M  Offline
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MERRITTISLAND, FL
There are some photos courtesy of Dingram on the F16 website forum, as well as some detail expaining the differences between the 2 designs.

There should be some shots underway when the Tradewinds phots are published, and we will be doing some more set up-tuning and 2 boat testing as soon as the weather warms up.

M

Re: Falcon [Re: Matt M] #165600
01/21/09 03:32 PM
01/21/09 03:32 PM

S
Scarecrow
Unregistered
Scarecrow
Unregistered
S



how about posting some here for those who aren't members yet

Re: Falcon [Re: ] #165620
01/21/09 04:46 PM
01/21/09 04:46 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline

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West coast of Norway
Here you go.

Remember, it was on the class forum first wink
http://formula16.net/forum
Directly: http://www.formula16.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=2

https://home.comcast.net/~smalldog266/smalldog266/Pictures/F16_Falcon/DSC_0018.JPG
https://home.comcast.net/~smalldog266/smalldog266/Pictures/F16_Falcon/DSC_0019.JPG
https://home.comcast.net/~smalldog266/smalldog266/Pictures/F16_Falcon/DSC_0021.JPG
https://home.comcast.net/~smalldog266/smalldog266/Pictures/F16_Falcon/DSC_0022.JPG

Re: Falcon [Re: ] #165653
01/21/09 06:47 PM
01/21/09 06:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
scooby_simon Offline
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
scooby_simon  Offline
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
Originally Posted by Scarecrow
how about posting some here for those who aren't members yet


You can join the forum without being members; you can then post in the public area; members get to see more!!!


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
Re: Falcon [Re: Tony_F18] #165669
01/22/09 02:32 AM
01/22/09 02:32 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,046
Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
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In the starting line photo above you may notice there were 4 F16's starting with the F18 class at Tradewinds. This was a change to the original start sequence that had the F16's starting 3 minutes behind the F18's. Matt pushed for this change and he went to every F18 skipper to ask permission first.

Thanks F18 Skippers for allowing us to start with you, I hope we didn't adversly affect your starts or finishes, it was great practice for us since we would have been very few starting alone.

Incidently, there were several F18 Skippers who said they wanted to start with the Inter 20's, so maybe next year we should push the RC to start all the spinnaker boats together?


Blade F16
#777
Re: Falcon [Re: Timbo] #165685
01/22/09 10:02 AM
01/22/09 10:02 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
Carpal Tunnel
David Ingram  Offline
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Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
Tim, please don't assume "more is better" when you're not racing against the "more" because for many it's not better.

If a fleet has the numbers like the 20 class did they deserve their own start. You never see classes with the numbers soliciting the classes with smaller numbers it's always the other way around (in my experience). If you guys hadnít approached us I would have been perfectly happy starting with the eight we had. Itís hard to look at a friend and say piss off.

For me, getting our own start is a perk for getting the numbers on the line in the first place.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: Falcon [Re: David Ingram] #165696
01/22/09 11:12 AM
01/22/09 11:12 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 548
MERRITTISLAND, FL
Matt M Offline
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Matt M  Offline
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MERRITTISLAND, FL
Originally Posted by David Ingram
For me, getting our own start is a perk for getting the numbers on the line in the first place.


Ding, first thanks for not saying "piss off"

I can see your point, but.... If I was in a the fleet with 40 and there were other boats of "similar" capabilities I would be all for getting them on the line as well.

More boats for me improves the racing. (I do not want something of drasticly differing performance in the mix like adding the Wave fleet) Big fleet starts are something we do not get to have very often and it is the biggest thrill and advange to having a "fleet" for me. Having more boats, is also (IMO) the best way to force one to improve their boat handling skills.

I do not agree with the argument about getting run over or up by another boat that is not being scored with you. On the line you are forced to race everyone and the guys who win regularly will still come out ahead with more baots, and developing those skills (or any skills) is why I race. Name a race besides a 1 design or class nationals where there are not other boats on the course that may or may not effect your outcome in a race wheter it is on the starting line or not. The Waves were not starting with us at Tradewinds, but I know they effected me on a number of occasions, and Mike Hill even a bit more. Dodging boats is all part of the tactics same as missing crab pots and trying to pick shifts.

This may not be everyones opinion obviously, but I go to regattas for the social aspect, but I race becuase I am trying to learn more every time I am on the boat. The moment I have quit learing, I am done. The more boats on the course the more it is mixed up and the more there is to learn.


Re: Falcon [Re: Matt M] #165701
01/22/09 11:54 AM
01/22/09 11:54 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
Carpal Tunnel
David Ingram  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
Matt, we've had this debate before and neither one of us have changed our position, kind of like that drill baby drill thread or the change the rating system thread.

In all honesty if you guys had more than 4 boats I would have problaby said no thank you. Bottom line, if the fleet I'm racing in has decent numbers and for me 8 is decent then adding fleets I'm not racing against doesn't enhance the experience for me. I have to race mixed fleets most of the of the season, I'd like to have a couple of regattas were it's just one fleet and for me it's Tradewinds and Spring Fever.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
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