Dave, you're off the hook on this one. The incident in question took place at GYC a month or so ago between Robi and I.

You're right, there is no way I could be the "butt" in question. I'm one of the nicest people I know.

You're right, there is no way I could be the "butt" in question. I'm one of the nicest people I know.

No you are not. LOL

Karl:
IMO You knew I was in a bad situation, Yes I could have tacked absolutely correct, I was close hauled heading to weather, you passed it really close and I could not squeeze in between you and the dinghy if I did there would have been a collision either with you or the dinghy, I chose neither option and slacked the main to slow down and get behind you.

You played your rules, fine.

If it were me, I would have given you room, even if I have all the rights in the world not. IMO that is OUTSTANDING sportsmanship. Safety first rules second, that is how I sail. I will avoid a situation at all cost even if it cost me a spot or two because I will know in my conscience I did the right thing to avoid a bigger situation.

Simon, but seing how the F16 is using a spin to sail downwind and the A is a uni rig, I would assume the F16 must sail a deeper course, if he or she is sailing higher than an A downwind then the F16 would be pinching. NO?

[/quote]This is where good sportsmanship comes into play.

Sometimes playing by the rules is OK, but pushing the rules can be dangerous as well. We were booking good speed I want to say 10+ kts upwind.

I was in this situation where we were both on starboard, heading to the weather mark. Leeward boat was maybe half a boat length in front. He came up and pinch me against a dingy tethered to an anchored yacht. I had no where to go and eased off my sails to fall off and prevent hitting any vessels.

I was told there was navigable waters around the yacht and dinghy so I had no rights for room.

I think this situation is similar...

Ok, from a tactical stand point, why would one do that to a boat that is not in their class? If that would not affect their standing in their own class but possibly the other boats standing (if it caused them to lose a place) in its own class, what would be the point? If you are in a O.D. class is the elapsed time a factor? Or just first to finish? If it is time then why wait for the other boat to get close then head up? Why not just shoot for the finish as fast as possible?

Regardless of the rules, it just seems someone is just trying to P.O. someone else.

Inquiring minds,

Clayton

You're right, there is no way I could be the "butt" in question. I'm one of the nicest people I know.

Two boats on starboard tack. A F16 is finishing downwind (under spinnaker). Can he legally head up, preventing an A cat (or any other type) from finishing. ... he is not sailing above proper course.

I was in this situation where we were both on starboard, heading to the weather mark. Leeward boat was maybe half a boat length in front. He came up and pinch me against a dingy tethered to an anchored yacht. I had no where to go and eased off my sails to fall off and prevent hitting any vessels.

I was told there was navigable waters around the yacht and dinghy so I had no rights for room.

I think this situation is similar...

Let's nail down some facts:
1) Both boats are on the same tack (starboard in this case).
2) The boats are overlapped.
3) It is the leeward (L) boat's proper course to finish at the mark.
4a) They are more than three boat-lengths from the finish mark or,
4b) They are at the three boat-length zone from the finish mark.
5) L was able to give W (windward) room at the mark at the time they became overlapped (potentially long before they reached the zone).

Because L is not sailing above her proper course (fact 3), rule 17 does not apply and need not be considered.

While they are outside the zone (fact 4a), rule 18 does not apply. Rule 11 does (facts 1,2) and W must keep clear of L. L may change course provided she gives W room to keep clear under rule 16.1.

When they reach the zone, they are overlapped (fact 4b) and W is inside. Because L was able to give mark-room when the overlap was established, she must give W mark-room within the zone under rule 18.2(b).

In short, you can't pinch somebody off the finish line.

I hope that helps,
Eric
US Sailing Certified Judge,
Member Area D Appeals Committee

For a long time I was of a similar opinion to you that a closed start finish line should not be viewed as an obstruction. I have had a discussion regarding that situation with several different judges and the concensus that I got was that it is an obstruction, and must be treated as such, if it is deemed to be closed by the SI's.

Is there any rule requiring you cross the finish line from a certain direction?

If you were pinched out of the finish line downwind, is there any reason you couldn't douse the spin, round up and cross the finish line close-hauled?

You were told wrong. The "navigable water" part applies only at the start. See the preamble to Part 2, Section C.

The anchored yacht and dinghy you describe were an obstruction. Since the leeward boat chose to sail below them, he was obligated to give you (as inside boat) room to avoid it.

The situation originally described took place at the finish, not the start, so rule 18 does apply.

Regards,
Eric
US Sailing Certified Judge,
Member Area D Appeals Committee

The open spin class and A class were started together but scored separately. The F16 was trying to finish as quickly as possible to obtain the best score in that class. The A cat, in this case was more like a moving obstacle rather than a competitor.