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F18 Worlds #234359
07/05/11 07:41 AM
07/05/11 07:41 AM
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TEAMVMG Offline OP
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The worlds have started and after 4 races, there is a nice mix of boats at the front of the fleet;

http://2011.f18worlds.com/

A couple of nations are conspicuous by their absence, I think we may be in for a ticking off by the International Class Assoc

Last edited by TEAMVMG; 07/05/11 07:45 AM.

Paul

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Re: F18 Worlds [Re: TEAMVMG] #234366
07/05/11 09:11 AM
07/05/11 09:11 AM
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David Ingram Offline
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Originally Posted by TEAMVMG
The worlds have started and after 4 races, there is a nice mix of boats at the front of the fleet;

http://2011.f18worlds.com/

A couple of nations are conspicuous by their absence, I think we may be in for a ticking off by the International Class Assoc


35 knots... that is a little sporty.

I really don't see how the International Class Assoc. could say anything regarding who is in attendance or not and if they did it would be a converstaion I would look forward to.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
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"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: David Ingram] #234367
07/05/11 09:20 AM
07/05/11 09:20 AM
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pgp Offline
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Got popcorn everyone?


Pete Pollard
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'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: F18 Worlds [Re: pgp] #234372
07/05/11 09:57 AM
07/05/11 09:57 AM
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David Ingram Offline
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Pete, what is it that you think you see here?

Paul made a comment I don't particularly agree with, no big deal it happens. Personally I don't think the International Class would say anything and I believe they fully understand the issues with getting to Worlds. If they did have something to say I certianly would want to be included in the converation.

Sorry to disappoint.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: pgp] #234373
07/05/11 09:59 AM
07/05/11 09:59 AM
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Jake Offline
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Originally Posted by pgp
Got popcorn everyone?


Why? It was in Hungary...which is very inland Europe and hard to get to from anywhere outside of Europe. There are several Austrailian teams present - the usual rock stars...but there are several Aussy teams that are usually at the worlds that aren't there too. Logistically, it is just a difficult place to get to for anyone outside of Europe not to mention that the event is being held on an inland lake where the weather conditions are less consistent than would be at a coastal venue.

Roughly scanning the countries, it appears 95% of the teams are from Europe and that only 7 are from outside of Europe. 15 are from Hungary itself. I wouldn't say that no US or Canada, or Mexico (Brazil, etc.) participation is that surprising.


Jake Kohl
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: David Ingram] #234374
07/05/11 10:02 AM
07/05/11 10:02 AM
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pgp Offline
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"...it would be a converstaion I would look forward to."

I was looking forward to it.


Pete Pollard
Blade 702

'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: F18 Worlds [Re: pgp] #234377
07/05/11 10:15 AM
07/05/11 10:15 AM
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David Ingram Offline
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Again, sorry to disappoint.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: David Ingram] #234390
07/05/11 11:40 AM
07/05/11 11:40 AM
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I'm at the worlds at the moment and with only a 100 boats, participation really is quite low.
I think one of the reasons the number of entries is down is the reputation of lake Balaton as a low wind location with the typical lake winds.
Although I dont know how on earth you could fit 200 cats here anyway, there is barely enough room for a 100!
Another reason is the distance, its a 1400km drive which is a lot for european standards but its not too bad as the roads are really good.
IMO the Argentinian team did the smart thing by renting a Nacra in Holland for a few week, they did the Nacra Worlds, Round Texel, and now the F18 Worlds.

Winds were very shifty today, spent 5h on the water but every race was abandoned due to huge shifts and differences in pressure.
In one race you could do the upwind tack with the kite up!


Re: F18 Worlds [Re: Tony_F18] #234395
07/05/11 01:24 PM
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OK, I'm with Ding on this, where exactly is the issue? Why is ISAF going to be ticked, Paul?

This is an International Class hosting a World Championship. A quick view of the results of this particular World Championship regatta shows participation of over 100 boats, representing at least 4 continents, and a bunch of countries.

ISAF Reg 25.2.1(b) is easily being met.

I've been to a Worlds regatta with 21 keelboats. There are lots of classes out there that would kill to have 100 boats at Worlds, let alone "down from 200."

Incidentally, that wind map scares me (with all the twists and shifts and shafts of wind)!

Mike

Re: F18 Worlds [Re: brucat] #234399
07/05/11 01:58 PM
07/05/11 01:58 PM
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How are the Balaton mosquitos Tony, have you all been feeding them?


John Alani
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Re: F18 Worlds [Re: brucat] #234400
07/05/11 02:15 PM
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TEAMVMG Offline OP
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Originally Posted by brucat
OK, I'm with Ding on this, where exactly is the issue? Why is ISAF going to be ticked, Paul?

This is an International Class hosting a World Championship. A quick view of the results of this particular World Championship regatta shows participation of over 100 boats, representing at least 4 continents, and a bunch of countries.

ISAF Reg 25.2.1(b) is easily being met.

I've been to a Worlds regatta with 21 keelboats. There are lots of classes out there that would kill to have 100 boats at Worlds, let alone "down from 200."

Incidentally, that wind map scares me (with all the twists and shifts and shafts of wind)!

Mike


why are you bringing ISAF into this?


Paul

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Re: F18 Worlds [Re: TEAMVMG] #234401
07/05/11 02:28 PM
07/05/11 02:28 PM
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Mark Schneider Offline
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Isn't the job of the international class to manage worlds to grow the class and serve the membership. Aren't they supposed to zap the regions that don't play.

It's the you come to my event... I will come to your event bargain!

Does the f18 promote teams from afar with sponsoring a container from each continent?



crac.sailregattas.com
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: Mark Schneider] #234403
07/05/11 02:43 PM
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David Ingram Offline
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Originally Posted by Mark Schneider
Aren't they supposed to zap the regions that don't play.


Are you saying the nations that don't show should some how be santioned? Is that what your are suggesting?


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall
"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: Mark Schneider] #234404
07/05/11 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Mark Schneider
Isn't the job of the international class to manage worlds to grow the class and serve the membership. Aren't they supposed to zap the regions that don't play.

It's the you come to my event... I will come to your event bargain!

Does the f18 promote teams from afar with sponsoring a container from each continent?



Pete, you might want to reheat that popcorn.


Jake Kohl
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: David Ingram] #234405
07/05/11 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by David Ingram
Originally Posted by Mark Schneider
Aren't they supposed to zap the regions that don't play.


Are you saying the nations that don't show should some how be santioned? Is that what your are suggesting?


As in, we have too much participation in our sport and need to find new ways to exclude people...yah...right.


Jake Kohl
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: Jake] #234409
07/05/11 03:19 PM
07/05/11 03:19 PM
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Mark Schneider Offline
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Who said exclude individual sailors.

The international class could not put the worlds in your neck of the woods any time soon ...

They could reduce the slots your country is allocated on the initial deal. (Occasionally this will be important to you)

If they get sponsor money, they could direct it to regions that have supported worlds by attending in the past.... eg container subsidies.

They can reduce your voting rights or ability to submit proposals.

The basics... of I will come to your event... if you will come to my event hold...even at the world level.

I am not recommending any action... sounded like Paul was talking about a strong phone call or email or two.








crac.sailregattas.com
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: TEAMVMG] #234410
07/05/11 03:24 PM
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Paul, you still haven't answered why anyone is going to be ticked.

I mentioned ISAF, because since those requirements are being met, nothing is in jeopardy for the class association.

I could see the class association thinking twice about awarding a future Worlds to a country/continent that consistently doesn't support events in other regions, but I don't see that as the case here.

Again, what are we missing?

Mike

EDIT: Mark and I were writing at the same time, he is giving other excellent examples of things that could be done, but I don't necessarily think that this one event warrants any action at this time.

Last edited by brucat; 07/05/11 03:26 PM.
Re: F18 Worlds [Re: Jake] #234411
07/05/11 03:30 PM
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smile Was there ever any doubt?


Pete Pollard
Blade 702

'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.

Re: F18 Worlds [Re: pgp] #234413
07/05/11 03:36 PM
07/05/11 03:36 PM
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TEAMVMG Offline OP
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Just click on the link and look at the pretty pictures


Paul

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Re: F18 Worlds [Re: Mark Schneider] #234418
07/05/11 04:01 PM
07/05/11 04:01 PM
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Jake Offline
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Orrrrr...you could look at it in a productive positive, business-like manner (the class assoc. would be much more likely to do). Instead of "sanctioning" a weak part of the world and making it weaker, they're probably more likely to host a worlds there, provide support, incentivate, etc. Do things to make it stronger.



Jake Kohl
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