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Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: Wouter] #237739
09/16/11 05:29 PM
09/16/11 05:29 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Mark Schneider Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mark Schneider  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Wouter

Nacra went narrow relative to your choice of 8'6 on your Typhoon.

What do you expect the tradeoffs to be compared with the current boats?




crac.sailregattas.com
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: Mark Schneider] #237741
09/16/11 05:38 PM
09/16/11 05:38 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Karl_Brogger  Offline
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Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
It's not 8 feet- 2 inches Mark, its 8.2 inches / 2.5 meters, which is max F16 width. Same as all the others.


I'm boatless.
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: Karl_Brogger] #237743
09/16/11 05:57 PM
09/16/11 05:57 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 443
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
bobcat Offline
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bobcat  Offline
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Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Uh, that would be 8.2 feet.

And .2 of a foot is 2.4 inches



F16 Blade 716
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: bobcat] #237744
09/16/11 06:00 PM
09/16/11 06:00 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Karl_Brogger  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Oops, you is correct. My FXone was 8'-4", and that's probably what I was thinking. Either way, its max width.

Last edited by Karl_Brogger; 09/16/11 06:04 PM.

I'm boatless.
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: Karl_Brogger] #237745
09/16/11 06:03 PM
09/16/11 06:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Mark Schneider Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mark Schneider  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
DoH!

Thank you....
(better get my glasses adjusted)


crac.sailregattas.com
Re: New Nacra F16 info [Re: waynemarlow] #237749
09/16/11 07:14 PM
09/16/11 07:14 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 806
Toronto, Ontario
pitchpoledave Offline OP
old hand
pitchpoledave  Offline OP
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 806
Toronto, Ontario
Wayne, regarding the F17, the only version the matters is the current one which is quite a good boat. The mast is the same as the Infusion and the new sail plan is really good. The hull design is dated I think we all agree on that. But it is a very nice boat to sail. I think people are way too caught up the "latest and greatest" hull design fads.. The F17 is a true one design class that works..




Re: New Nacra F16 info [Re: pitchpoledave] #237752
09/16/11 08:31 PM
09/16/11 08:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
mbounds Offline
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mbounds  Offline
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Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
Originally Posted by pitchpoledave
Wayne, regarding the F17, the only version the matters is the current one which is quite a good boat. The mast is the same as the Infusion and the new sail plan is really good. The hull design is dated I think we all agree on that. But it is a very nice boat to sail. I think people are way too caught up the "latest and greatest" hull design fads.. The F17 is a true one design class that works..

I'm going to call BS on that. Carbon masts, aluminum masts, different sail areas, sloop rigs, uni rigs, different platform weights do not make a "one design class".

What you are saying is, "FU to all you guys who bought Inter 17s and NACRA 17s - even though they superficially look the same, they aren't the same boat. Sorry." Nice marketing strategy (and class management). No wonder the class is dying.

Re: New Nacra F16 info [Re: mbounds] #237756
09/16/11 09:43 PM
09/16/11 09:43 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 602
Wilmington,NC
Dlennard Offline
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Dlennard  Offline
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Posts: 602
Wilmington,NC

[/quote]
- even though they superficially look the same, they aren't the same boat. Sorry." Nice marketing strategy (and class management). [/quote]

Like the Hobie Tiger one design

Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: Mark Schneider] #237758
09/16/11 10:17 PM
09/16/11 10:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,911
South Florida & the Keys
arbo06 Offline
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South Florida & the Keys
My apologies. In this current economy, hopefully, even sailors are concerned with mundane things such as initial investment, normal and regular maintenance, and damage repairs. Why would we question a manufacturer giving us a boat that will have some sort of a shelf life?


Eric Arbogast
ARC 2101
Miami Yacht Club
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: arbo06] #237760
09/17/11 12:11 AM
09/17/11 12:11 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,021
Australia
macca Offline
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macca  Offline
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Posts: 1,021
Australia
Originally Posted by arbo06
My apologies. In this current economy, hopefully, even sailors are concerned with mundane things such as initial investment, normal and regular maintenance, and damage repairs. Why would we question a manufacturer giving us a boat that will have some sort of a shelf life?


What if Hobie or Cirrus build an F16 to min weight, then it's well built, fast and lasts long? Does that mean the existing heavy boats sit on the shelf? smile

Door still wide open...


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Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: Mark Schneider] #237761
09/17/11 01:30 AM
09/17/11 01:30 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Wouter  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
The others already replied to your earlier posting.

Indeed, the metric units in brochure all seem to match up with the F16 class rules.

Or at least the ones that are quoted.



Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: macca] #237764
09/17/11 05:39 AM
09/17/11 05:39 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 893
W
waynemarlow Offline
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waynemarlow  Offline
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W

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 893
Originally Posted by macca

What if Hobie or Cirrus build an F16 to min weight, then it's well built, fast and lasts long? Does that mean the existing heavy boats sit on the shelf? smile

Door still wide open...


We already have F16 manufacturers making boats at weight, well made ( probably better in some ways to get local high tech production where the boats are built by highly skilled workers)and will last as long as any other manufacturer, with the same warranties, they just don't yet have the brand image of the big boys ( read can't afford to have paid top jockies to smoke them around the course ) and that has always been the problem for the F16 class, the big boys wanted to protect there own one design boats.

Now finally we have a reason for the big boys to get involved, namely the Olympic mixed boat. Sadly AHPC who have made all the running to date and put a lot of investment in to secure sales in the class now have other contenders, they may just yet have to bite the bullit and make a class weight boat to gain any advantage, it will annoy there already considerable number of owners but they may just have to do it.

Last edited by waynemarlow; 09/17/11 05:41 AM.
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: macca] #237769
09/17/11 08:23 AM
09/17/11 08:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,911
South Florida & the Keys
arbo06 Offline
Pooh-Bah
arbo06  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,911
South Florida & the Keys
True. If....


Eric Arbogast
ARC 2101
Miami Yacht Club
Re: From the F-16 forum... not my words [Re: waynemarlow] #237779
09/17/11 08:54 PM
09/17/11 08:54 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,479
Thailand
Buccaneer Offline
veteran
Buccaneer  Offline
veteran

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,479
Thailand
nice shape on the nacra from first rate designers however overweight. Bottom line is the lighter weight boats are far more labor intensive and also require a higher level of expertise to build with less room for error and less profitable...

The Taipan seems to be faster with less beam as do the a-cats. So perhaps then building to max beam width does not necessarily equate to faster boat...

Originally Posted by waynemarlow
Originally Posted by macca

What if Hobie or Cirrus build an F16 to min weight, then it's well built, fast and lasts long? Does that mean the existing heavy boats sit on the shelf? smile

Door still wide open...


We already have F16 manufacturers making boats at weight, well made ( probably better in some ways to get local high tech production where the boats are built by highly skilled workers)and will last as long as any other manufacturer, with the same warranties, they just don't yet have the brand image of the big boys ( read can't afford to have paid top jockies to smoke them around the course ) and that has always been the problem for the F16 class, the big boys wanted to protect there own one design boats.

Now finally we have a reason for the big boys to get involved, namely the Olympic mixed boat. Sadly AHPC who have made all the running to date and put a lot of investment in to secure sales in the class now have other contenders, they may just yet have to bite the bullit and make a class weight boat to gain any advantage, it will annoy there already considerable number of owners but they may just have to do it.


"House prices have risen by nearly 25 percent over the past two years. Although speculative activity has increased in some areas, at a national level these price increases largely reflect strong economic fundamentals." Ben Bernanke 2005
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