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2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails #99614
02/23/07 04:31 AM
02/23/07 04:31 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 285
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Catfan Offline OP
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Catfan  Offline OP
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F18 World Championships - Overall Results
Yeppoon, Australia - February 19 - 25

The coverage of the event is excellent.
However there is no official indication of boats/sails used by the crew.
I tried to guess the choices of the top ten in the standings.
Please amend my statement if incorrect

1 M.Booth-P.Nieuwenhis Hobie Tiger/Ullman Italy? (no logo)
2 D.Bundock-G.Ashby Hobie Tiger/Ullman Italy? (no logo)
3 B.Besson-A.Jarlegan Hobie Tiger/ ???
4 M.Heemskerk-C.Rasley Hobie Tiger/???
5 J.C.Mourniac-F.Citeau Hobie Tiger/???
6 S.Brewin-A.Williams AHPC Capricorn/Brewin?
7 C.Brouwer-J.Van Leeuwen Nacra Infusion/Performance
8 F.Echavarri-A.Paz Blanco Hobie Cat/Ullman Italy (no logo)9 R.Daniel-H.Stunzi AHPC Capricorn/Goodall
10 R.Greenhalgh-P.Greenhalgh AHPC Capricorn/Goodall

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: Catfan] #99615
02/23/07 04:58 AM
02/23/07 04:58 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 285
C
Catfan Offline OP
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Catfan  Offline OP
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I made a mistake in my previous posting
I found a pic that show that Besson and Jarlegan are sailing a Nacra Infusion equipped with Performance sails

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: Catfan] #99616
02/23/07 06:02 AM
02/23/07 06:02 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 103
The Netherlands
Boomer Offline
member
Boomer  Offline
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 103
The Netherlands
Heemskerk must be on a Nacra Infusion with Performance Sails

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: Boomer] #99617
02/23/07 06:33 AM
02/23/07 06:33 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 285
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Catfan Offline OP
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You should be right!
Then in the top 5 spots we have 3 Tigers, (1st,2nd and 5th), and 2 Infusions (3rd and 4th).

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: Catfan] #99618
02/23/07 07:55 AM
02/23/07 07:55 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
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I think internationally, the F18 class is careful to not list that information - not like the A-Class where it is frequently listed in the official results. I like the principle behind that; the notion that it is more to do with the sailor than the boat. But if you're trying to see how boats stack up, you might want to first take the professionals out of the picture and see how mere mortals are doing on boats that they bought with their own cash. No offense or slight intended to those who get significant sponsorship and sail for a living - I think that's awsome, and anyone who argues that the pros are doing anything other than elevating the sport are just not seeing the forest for the trees. I tend to place some importance on the position of teams that are self-financed and without coaching programs, etc., because that is where I am. The F18 class is tough - more and more sponsor money is coming in, and more and more people are getting into the class who sail more often than the average weekend warrior can manage.

Anyway, I'm looking at the standings with an eye toward the guys I know have equipment I have access to and can afford. Some of the stuff in the fleet simply isn't available to the average joe because it is so new and is still being developed using top teams that can evaluate the incremental benefits of new sail cuts, materials, hardware, etc.

Again - don't flame me for being honest here. I have a deep sense of respect and gratitude for the people who have managed to turn a hobby into something a lot more serious. Without their involvement, I wouldn't be watching live coverage of an event on the other side of the world. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: John Williams] #99619
02/23/07 04:38 PM
02/23/07 04:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia
C2 Mike Offline
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C2 Mike  Offline
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Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia
Quote
I think internationally, the F18 class is careful to not list that information - not like the A-Class where it is frequently listed in the official results. I like the principle behind that; the notion that it is more to do with the sailor than the boat. But if you're trying to see how boats stack up, you might want to first take the professionals out of the picture and see how mere mortals are doing on boats that they bought with their own cash. No offense or slight intended to those who get significant sponsorship and sail for a living - I think that's awsome, and anyone who argues that the pros are doing anything other than elevating the sport are just not seeing the forest for the trees. I tend to place some importance on the position of teams that are self-financed and without coaching programs, etc., because that is where I am. The F18 class is tough - more and more sponsor money is coming in, and more and more people are getting into the class who sail more often than the average weekend warrior can manage.
Anyway, I'm looking at the standings with an eye toward the guys I know have equipment I have access to and can afford. Some of the stuff in the fleet simply isn't available to the average joe because it is so new and is still being developed using top teams that can evaluate the incremental benefits of new sail cuts, materials, hardware, etc.


I can confirm that Bundock is sailing the same Tiger that everybody else can buy with the exception of the new rudder system (don't know if it is on the market yet or not). His Main, jib and spi are all stock Hobie. The only mods are by means of rope which most people change to their own personal preference anyway.

cheers,
Tiger Mike

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: C2 Mike] #99620
02/23/07 06:07 PM
02/23/07 06:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
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Quote
...with the exception of the new rudder system (don't know if it is on the market yet or not).


Thanks, Mike - it looks like you agree with me. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: John Williams] #99621
02/23/07 07:13 PM
02/23/07 07:13 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
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Anyone know why the sailnumber 7 is so popular? (Lucky number?).
From the top ten boats, 5 have sailnumber 7.

http://2007f18worlds.com/results/f18-worlds_overall.html

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: Catfan] #99622
02/23/07 11:53 PM
02/23/07 11:53 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 806
Toronto, Ontario
pitchpoledave Offline
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pitchpoledave  Offline
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Toronto, Ontario
What I think is a more interesting list is who is a PRO sailor and who has a day job or doesn't need the money.. Can someone put that list together?

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: John Williams] #99623
02/24/07 04:41 AM
02/24/07 04:41 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia
C2 Mike Offline
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C2 Mike  Offline
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Quote
Quote
...with the exception of the new rudder system (don't know if it is on the market yet or not).


Thanks, Mike - it looks like you agree with me. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


Probably - the notion that Aus7 is on anything beyond stock Hobie is rubbish. I did measure 2 spi's for the worlds. One is the current spec Hobie item (as found on boats sold in the last year or so) and one of the previous versions. Not sure which they are using however Glen did say that what is more important that it's easy to set than the spi's raw speed overall.

For the record, neither were anywhere close to the limit. The bottom line is that these guys are good - it has nothing to do with having "special equipment".

Cheers,

Tiger Mike

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: pitchpoledave] #99624
02/24/07 05:19 AM
02/24/07 05:19 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Quote
What I think is a more interesting list is who is a PRO sailor and who has a day job or doesn't need the money.. Can someone put that list together?

As far as I can tell the first 13 sailors are all Pro's (with a possible exception of Steve Brewin, the Aussies might know).

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: C2 Mike] #99625
02/24/07 06:14 AM
02/24/07 06:14 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 18
CatsailorAus Offline
stranger
CatsailorAus  Offline
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Posts: 18
1 Darren Bundock - Hobie
2 Mitch Booth - Hobie
3 Billy Besson - Nacra
4 Mischa Heemskerk Nacra
5 Hugh Styles - Nacra
6 Steve Brewin - Capricorn
7 Jean-Christophe Mourniac - Hobie
8 Carolijn Brouwer - Nacra
9 Fernando Echavarri - Hobie
10 Brad Collett - Capricorn

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: CatsailorAus] #99626
02/24/07 09:44 AM
02/24/07 09:44 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 954
Mumbles Y.C Wales U.K
Mark P Offline
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Mark P  Offline
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Mumbles Y.C Wales U.K
I'm almost positive that Hugh Styles is on a Tiger not a NACRA


MP*MULTIHULLS
Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: Mark P] #99627
02/24/07 09:46 AM
02/24/07 09:46 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Quote
I'm almost positive that Hugh Styles is on a Tiger not a NACRA

He's a Nacra team rider: http://www.nacraeurope.com/news_details.php?id=59

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: C2 Mike] #99628
02/24/07 10:41 AM
02/24/07 10:41 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
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Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
Quote
The bottom line is that these guys are good - it has nothing to do with having "special equipment".


Oi! Mike! I never said anything of the sort - my assertion is that the manufacturers and lofts give this "special equipment" to guys like that because they're good. Who in the back of the fleet can give better assessment of an incremental improvement?

Anyway, to make the point again - when looking at how boats stack up at an event like this, I tend to take some guys out of the standings simply because they're pro or near-pro status and are likely to have things on the boat that you wouldn't get stock from a dealer. That's all.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: John Williams] #99629
02/24/07 11:21 AM
02/24/07 11:21 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Quote
Quote
The bottom line is that these guys are good - it has nothing to do with having "special equipment".


Oi! Mike! I never said anything of the sort - my assertion is that the manufacturers and lofts give this "special equipment" to guys like that because they're good. Who in the back of the fleet can give better assessment of an incremental improvement?

Anyway, to make the point again - when looking at how boats stack up at an event like this, I tend to take some guys out of the standings simply because they're pro or near-pro status and are likely to have things on the boat that you wouldn't get stock from a dealer. That's all.


I'm convinced that Bundy and Booth's cats are standard 2007 of-the-shelf Tigers.

I mean, not even an adjustable jib downhaul:
[Linked Image]

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: C2 Mike] #99630
02/24/07 04:04 PM
02/24/07 04:04 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,147
Bay of Islands, NZ
W
warbird Offline
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Bay of Islands, NZ
These guys have to be awesome as they can move from boat to baot with ease.

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: warbird] #99631
02/25/07 04:09 PM
02/25/07 04:09 PM

A
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
A



The Tigers were standard 2006 model Hobie Tigers with the Rudder upgrade (and spi hoop upgrade on Mitch's boat) ex-Hobie Cat Australia. The sails are out of the box not "special" sails.

Standard Box-stock Tigers
Standard Box-stock Sails

End of story.
Steve

Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: ] #99632
02/25/07 08:12 PM
02/25/07 08:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
Shall I schedule your wake-up call, or continue to let you sleep in so you can persist in the obtuse fantasy that I somehow said Bundy and Mitch are fast because they have special gear?

ps - Can you post a link to the catalog with the rudder and snuffer hoop upgrades? Is the rudder upgrade the EPO2 blades or is there something else to it?


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: 2007 F18 Worlds: boats and sails [Re: John Williams] #99633
02/25/07 11:41 PM
02/25/07 11:41 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
mbounds Offline
Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
The rudder upgrade is on new boats. I don't think they've made a retro-fit kit yet. The upgrade uses different gudgeons.

Pictures were in the Nov/Dec 06 Hotline, page 10

here

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