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Smaller sail for Hobie 16 #127174
12/29/07 07:50 PM
12/29/07 07:50 PM
Joined: May 2006
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mako Offline OP
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I sail a 16 in Pamlico sound at Hatteras. Lots of good steady wind. No problems around 15MPH. Above 20MPH this boat is a little much for a comfortable sail.Has anyone fitted a smaller main for high wind days. Would a sail and boom from a 14 work instead of reefing the 16 sail? I may buy a 16sail and cut it at the reef point. Does reefing the 16 sail tame this boat in say 20mph winds?

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Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127175
12/31/07 08:53 AM
12/31/07 08:53 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 224
Cincinnati, Ohio
Tri_X_Troll Offline
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Cincinnati, Ohio
I believe the mast is a different height, however I am not sure as to all the differences.

I think the different height mast would cause the most problems as it would not have the "catch" for the shorter sail.

I know that my comp tip mast does not have the bottom "halyard catch" (probably the wrong term) for when the sail is reefed. Apparently the older non-comp tip masts have a second catch.

From what I understand, reefing the sail should depower it quite a bit? Have you tried it with a reef, yet?

Cheers,
Ryan

Last edited by Tri_X_Troll; 12/31/07 08:55 AM.
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Tri_X_Troll] #127176
12/31/07 09:11 AM
12/31/07 09:11 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Northfield Mn
With the wire halyards there was a 2nd slug to catch.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Karl_Brogger] #127177
12/31/07 02:26 PM
12/31/07 02:26 PM
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mako Offline OP
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I sail from a dock and out of a canal system. I go most of the way out with an electric motor. When I hit the open water I need to get the sails up quickly and get going to keep from getting blown into shallow water. I have added a roller jib and I replaced the main halyard with a kevlar rope which ties off at the bottom of the mast. Everything works well. The problem is this boat is overpowered for a comfortable sail. I added a quick reefing system but the thing is still to messy. I would think a sail sized to the conditions would make nice setup. Sailboards and kite sailers use equipment sized for conditions. I would like to find a 14 sail and boom for a higher wind setup. A cutoff 16 sail would be another possibility.

If I want speed, the big sail goes up. If I want a more relaxing sail or the wind is up, the smaller sail. I'll bet even with a small sail it will still be fast. I pitchpoled twice last year under the following conditions, 20mph wind and having to sail downwind in a narrow channel. Nowhere to turn. Once the sail is up you are off like a rocket. When I look back I should have reefed at home or got into open water with the jib only.

Anyone have any comments on sailing a 16 with reefed sail?

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127178
12/31/07 03:17 PM
12/31/07 03:17 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,187
38.912, -95.37
_flatlander_ Offline
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Quote
Anyone have any comments on sailing a 16 with reefed sail?
Yup, raced once with a reefed main in 35mph and gusting stuff. Boat was very controlable, able to drive upwind with only me (175#) single trapped. Crew was on tramp with both hands holding the un-cleated jib, and there's the problem in too much wind...a cleated jib and a strong gust will knock over a 16 <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />


John H16, H14
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: _flatlander_] #127179
01/01/08 02:09 PM
01/01/08 02:09 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Minnesota
Jeff Peterson Offline
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Jeff Peterson  Offline
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Minnesota
I've always been reluctant to reef. I would like to try it, but then I get concerned about the sail. Looking at the reef grommets in the sail, I'm concerned the stress at those limited points could be damaging to the sail, if done frequently. -So why get into a habit that may damage the sails ? Am I being a scaredy cat ?


Jeff Peterson
H-16 Sail #23721
Big Marine Lake, MN
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127180
01/02/08 03:13 AM
01/02/08 03:13 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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I wonder if a Wave sail would work. The Hobie 16 mainsail is 148 sq. ft., and the Wave main is 95 sq. ft.

Last edited by Mary; 01/02/08 04:56 AM.
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Mary] #127181
01/02/08 07:18 AM
01/02/08 07:18 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 206
Virginia USA
CMerrell Offline
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I don't think a Wave sail would work well. I think the loose foot of the Wave sail and differing foot lengths (Wave vs. H16) would create some funky sheeting angles. IMHO the ideal solution would be a H14 sail on a H16 boom. That solves downhaul/outhaul/sheeting angle problems. The stock halyard could be extended with a wire rope pigtail.

Somebody has to have done this before. Maybe a shout out on the Open Forum board is in order?

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: CMerrell] #127182
01/02/08 07:53 AM
01/02/08 07:53 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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When you reef a Hobie 16 sail, you also have a shorter foot length and, basically, a loose foot. It's just a matter of tying down the clew to the boom and pulling it tight with a line to the end of the boom. Wouldn't matter that it is shorter than the boom, would it? The fact that the Hobie 16 HAS a boom is what would make it possible to use a smaller sail. No?

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Mary] #127183
01/02/08 01:09 PM
01/02/08 01:09 PM
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mako Offline OP
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The 16 is the best choice for Pamlico sound. With no centerboards I can go anywhere. Lots of steady wind but 10 to 20 MPH days are common and the days I want to be out. If I look at the side view of all the cats, new and old, it looks like the 16 has lot of sail and the mast is farther forward than the others. At anything over 15mph it seems that the lee pontoon rides low, being forced down by lots high sail. I understand the Prindle sails more docile in heavy wind with its more flotation up front. I would think a 14 sail on a 16 wouldn't be much slower than a 16 sail and a lot easier to sail. I don't like the 16 sail reefed. It is sloppy and the stress is on individual points. I am going to look for a 14 sail and give it a try. I would buy the sail and boom for a dedicated setup if I can find one. Pamlico sound if full of sailboards and kites when the wind is 20mph. I would like to be out there but a full sail 16 would not be my first choice.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Mary] #127184
01/03/08 07:46 AM
01/03/08 07:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 206
Virginia USA
CMerrell Offline
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Quote
When you reef a Hobie 16 sail, you also have a shorter foot length and, basically, a loose foot. It's just a matter of tying down the clew to the boom and pulling it tight with a line to the end of the boom. Wouldn't matter that it is shorter than the boom, would it? The fact that the Hobie 16 HAS a boom is what would make it possible to use a smaller sail. No?


We may be talking two different scenarios. I assumed the H16 boom would not be used with a Wave sail. In that case, the main sheet would attach to the clew and, given that the foot of the Wave sail is shorter than a H16 sail, the sheets would angle forward and tend to tension the leech more than the foot.

I think you are suggesting using the Wave sail and attaching it to the boom in some fashion. I agree that would function similar to a reefed down H16 sail.

However, since the H14 and H16 mains are so similar (e.g. have a foot rope, use the same boom extrusion), I think a H14 sail would make the "neatest" set up. I have not used a H16 sail with reef points in many years and my experience with the Wave is limited so my discussion is all theoretical. Some real world results would be interesting.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127185
01/06/08 07:24 PM
01/06/08 07:24 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 471
NC
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drbinkle Offline
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Quote
Pamlico sound if full of sailboards and kites when the wind is 20mph. I would like to be out there but a full sail 16 would not be my first choice.


Keep using the full size sail, find a heavier crew and don't be scared to push the boat. Make those sailboarders and kiters realize what they're missing. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: drbinkle] #127186
01/07/08 02:27 PM
01/07/08 02:27 PM
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mako Offline OP
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Derek, where are you sailing on the outer banks? I haven't seen many Hobies on Pamlico sound for many years now. Maybe like one or two.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127187
01/07/08 05:21 PM
01/07/08 05:21 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 471
NC
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drbinkle Offline
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Albemarle or Currituck sounds usually. I live in Kill Devil Hills so Pamlico is a little far south for me.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: drbinkle] #127188
01/19/08 01:30 PM
01/19/08 01:30 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 78
rictorn Offline
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i have only sailed a few times with a reefed hobie 16 but when i have the boat has sailed realy well, i i were you i would get a old hobie 16 sail and get a sailmaker to cut it down to the reefing point then the wire will still clip in and the boat will sail well, i sailed the boat as a 13 year old with my mate and we weighed 7 stone each so it was always fun in a 4 or 5 and i had a beautiful swiss girlfreind crewing for years and we weighed 17 1/2 stone between us and were often faster reefed than swimmin

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127189
03/01/08 05:36 AM
03/01/08 05:36 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 61
davidtugwell Offline
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I have a hobie 16 main easy junior. It is like the hobie easy sail but only goes to the reefing point and doesnt use the boom. I am never use it. It has only been used 3 times. I would sell it if you want. I am in UK but could ship it. Also have a small soft jib (no battens.)


Stealth F16 The Black Pig
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127190
03/14/08 04:14 PM
03/14/08 04:14 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 251
beaufort, sc
dannyb9 Offline
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beaufort, sc
i have an older, reefable main and i use it when i'm sailing solo. i weigh about 160. if its blowing 20 or over, i leave the jib on the beach and sail 'uno style'. i started with a h 14 so tacking without the jib is not a problem, actually easier than a 14 'classic' because the 16's extra weight helps shoot through the tack. theres plenty of performance available for me with the reduced rig, hull flying is easy and predictable. if you reef properly i dont think theres any extra strain on the sail, the reef points are tied just tight enough to keep the foot from flapping around. the loads are on the halyard, tack, and outhaul.


marsh hawk
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: dannyb9] #127191
05/04/08 08:55 PM
05/04/08 08:55 PM
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mako Offline OP
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I lucked out and was given a set of sails for a 18'hobie. I cut the bottom off where the normal 16 would be reefed. I resewed in a rope. It is a little narrower than the normal 16. I'm going to give it a try in a couple of weeks. I also got the boom from the 18 and will try it on the 16. It is a loose foot with internal out haul.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: CMerrell] #127192
05/05/08 07:39 AM
05/05/08 07:39 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 40
Florida
Kathryn Offline
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Kathryn  Offline
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Florida
Quote
IMHO the ideal solution would be a H14 sail on a H16 boom. That solves downhaul/outhaul/sheeting angle problems. The stock halyard could be extended with a wire rope pigtail.


You are exactly correct. I used to do this years ago when I sailed both a 16 and a 14.
Now I sail a Hobie 17 and the 17 sail is a perfect fit on the Hobie 20 with a halyard pigtail.


Kathryn Garlick Evolution, 28R, #185
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127193
05/05/08 07:56 AM
05/05/08 07:56 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 40
Florida
Kathryn Offline
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Florida
Quote
I am going to look for a 14 sail and give it a try. I would buy the sail and boom for a dedicated setup if I can find one.

All you need is the 14 sail and a pigtail on your halyard. I don't know that a 14 boom would work well because of sheeting angles. A 16 boom works well with a 14 sail.


Kathryn Garlick Evolution, 28R, #185
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