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Alinghi VX40 capsize today #144424
05/30/08 09:40 AM
05/30/08 09:40 AM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,669
Melbourne, Australia
Tornado_ALIVE Offline OP
Pooh-Bah
Tornado_ALIVE  Offline OP
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Alinghi VX40 capsize today

See video here - http://www.isharescup.com/

[Linked Image]


-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Tornado_ALIVE] #144425
05/30/08 10:56 AM
05/30/08 10:56 AM
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Portland, Maine
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ThunderMuffin Offline
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This is getting comical.

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: ThunderMuffin] #144426
05/30/08 01:47 PM
05/30/08 01:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
scooby_simon Offline
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Tipping anything in uphill is a poor showing!

I guess some the monoslug sailors are not learning quick enough!

Maybe we all need to send our CV's in....


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: scooby_simon] #144427
05/30/08 02:28 PM
05/30/08 02:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
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It doesn't look like they were going uphill and it looks like their rudder stalled. How many of you would have stabbed it into the wind before it was too late? Was the boat behind them a bunch of pussies or smart?

Don't be bitter because they are getting paid.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
http://www.solarwind.solar

"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
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"You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: scooby_simon] #144428
05/30/08 02:29 PM
05/30/08 02:29 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 334
Seattle,Wa
Don_Atchley Offline
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I think you're passing jugdement a little too rapidly. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> Watch the video and you'll see the conditions under which this happened.

I'm trying to focus on the fact that they are sailing multihulls in the first place.

Not that they are going through the learning curve we have all experienced.

And they are "learning" on a boat that I would give anything just to have a ride.

Go get em' <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />


Hobie Tiger 2003
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: David Ingram] #144429
05/30/08 02:32 PM
05/30/08 02:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
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Portland, Maine
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ThunderMuffin Offline
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They were bearing off getting ready to deploy the genn when the top (you can see it in the pic) decided to let go. That much "bubble" at the top of the rig probably made it decide to go swimming.
You can see Holmatro's Genny in the drink.

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Don_Atchley] #144430
05/30/08 02:46 PM
05/30/08 02:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 571
Hamburg
Smiths_Cat Offline
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Quote
Not that they are going through the learning curve we have all experienced


Come on, malicious joy is the best joy.
By the way they are not the only boat, where the hooter opens, however the gust is certainly stronger for the two most forward boats than for the rest. But hey, no excuses for those guys, that are mono guys <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Cheers,

Klaus

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Smiths_Cat] #144431
05/30/08 02:52 PM
05/30/08 02:52 PM
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brucat Offline
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At the time they started losing it, it seemed like they were still heading up pretty high for having already rounded the windward mark.

But honestly, in strong wind on any cat, getting from upwind to downwind without losing it can be rough...

Mike

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Smiths_Cat] #144432
05/30/08 03:07 PM
05/30/08 03:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
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From what see, they might need some practice righting the boats, as they always seem to break the mast when doing so.

Maybe send a diver to the mast tip to tie a line whereby they can lift the boat by the mast tip (SLOWLY - to let the water move around the sail) rather than try to jerk the hulls to right the boat.

Or try to right the boat by flipping it over the sterns?

Just seems wierd that they keep breaking the sticks so easily...


Jay

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: David Ingram] #144433
05/30/08 03:59 PM
05/30/08 03:59 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
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scooby_simon Offline
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Quote
It doesn't look like they were going uphill and it looks like their rudder stalled. How many of you would have stabbed it into the wind before it was too late? Was the boat behind them a bunch of pussies or smart?

Don't be bitter because they are getting paid.


Not bitter.

I've also done them a dis-service, they were going downhill, (you can see the mark behind them). They just did not bear away far enough when the hull lifted, you can see from the onboard that they are (probably) far enough in front on Holmatro.
At about 9 seconds you can see they had some room to leeward; they could (maybe) have saved it by dumping some traveller and a bit of a bear-off.

Will know more in a couple of weeks as a mate is out on one for a jolly.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: scooby_simon] #144434
05/30/08 05:24 PM
05/30/08 05:24 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
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USA1273 Offline
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Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: USA1273] #144435
05/30/08 08:13 PM
05/30/08 08:13 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,669
Melbourne, Australia
Tornado_ALIVE Offline OP
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Just read they were reaching to a second mark, not going downwind. Probably should have kept a better eye behind on the puffs but that is easy to say whilst sitting here.

We have all been there (on smaller boats) at some time or another.


Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: USA1273] #144436
05/30/08 10:44 PM
05/30/08 10:44 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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That's a much better video!


Jake Kohl
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Jake] #144437
05/31/08 12:58 AM
05/31/08 12:58 AM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 145
Cheshire, UK
Simon Offline
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Simon  Offline
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Cheshire, UK
It looks like an instinctive 'head up' on Holmatro almost cost them a dunking too...


Simon
Shadow 067
Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Simon] #144438
05/31/08 01:17 AM
05/31/08 01:17 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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Ok, main traveller was out and mainsheet also looks like it was out, jib was out. I am not an Alinghi fan anymore, but I dont see much more the team could have done except going a bit deeper. Looks like they went by the book?
How Holmatro saved it I dont understand.

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #144439
05/31/08 02:33 AM
05/31/08 02:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 55
Los Angeles, CA
chrisun Offline
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Quote
How Holmatro saved it I dont understand.


Kind of looks like the "bad air" off of Alinghi might have helped Holmatro pull out by shifting the apparent wind.

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: chrisun] #144440
05/31/08 07:01 AM
05/31/08 07:01 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,226
Atlanta
bvining Offline
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Atlanta
Whats up with the boat turtling so fast, they need to seal the mast and put some floatation in the top, its retarted that they break the mast each time they go over.

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Simon] #144441
05/31/08 08:56 AM
05/31/08 08:56 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 266
UK
Cheshirecatman Offline
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UK
Quote
It looks like an instinctive 'head up' on Holmatro almost cost them a dunking too...


If you look closely on video2 Holmatro actually bore away and started to dig in. They had a better initial angle (and sheeting) to the gust (which hit Alinghi first), this enabled them to reduce pressure on the leeward hull by luffing. It appears to have also let them keep boatspeed and get away with the pendulum effect of the mast. I suspect if they had kept low they would have stuffed it too.

Cheshirecatman

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: Cheshirecatman] #144442
06/02/08 04:28 PM
06/02/08 04:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 182
Appleton, WI
blockp Offline
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Appleton, WI
Can someone explain the capsize (and the save) a little better than what my poor little brain can figure out from the video? Here's what I'm seeing.

Alinghi bore away and their leeward hull started to come back up, but then it looks like they turned upwind causing them to crash. At about :08, it looks like as that hull came back up they turned upwind, they could have bore away a bit more rather then turn upwind.

If that is correct, how did holmatro not dump it when they turned up? Their leeward was buried when they turned up. I'm not quite following cheshire's comment about the luffing. I see alinghi blew their jib at about :02, Holm never blew theirs. This should have helped right alinghi and hurt Holm.?

I ask because my initial instinct is always to head up when a gust hits or if I get too buried (sort of what holmatro did). Since I'm trying to train myself to bear away before heading up, I'm sitting here trying to rationalize in my brain why holmatro survived when it seems that they shouldn't have.

Re: Alinghi VX40 capsize today [Re: blockp] #144443
06/02/08 06:04 PM
06/02/08 06:04 PM
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Posts: 502
Port Noarlunga, SA, Australia
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Darryn Offline
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Quote


I ask because my initial instinct is always to head up when a gust hits or if I get too buried (sort of what holmatro did). Since I'm trying to train myself to bear away before heading up, I'm sitting here trying to rationalize in my brain why holmatro survived when it seems that they shouldn't have.


Holmatro survived when they dumped mainsheet as their cat rounded up when they lost rudder authority, watch their leach in the second video.

"They were somehow able to avoid capsizing and we did not unfortunately." Ed Baird

SOMEHOW Ed got to steer a fast catamaran without learning the basics.

Darryn
Mozzie
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