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Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: ksurfer2] #229453
03/08/11 09:03 AM
03/08/11 09:03 AM
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kyle robberts Offline
stranger
kyle robberts  Offline
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K

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Posts: 7
New Reels catch fish so purchase some
not under command
restricted in ability to maneuver
constrained by draft
fishing
sailboat
power boat (last in pecking order is sea plane)

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: BLR_0719] #229459
03/08/11 12:29 PM
03/08/11 12:29 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 172
Anacortes
Sloansailing Offline
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Anacortes
Originally Posted by BLR_0719
Originally Posted by Sloansailing
Sailboat always has right of way over sea plane. That said there is a level of common sense if they are coming in to land.


Not if it's a commercial vessel. Only if it's recreational.

Quote
A commercial vessel is defined by the United States Coast Guard as any vessel (i.e. boat or ship) engaged in commercial trade or that carries passengers for hire.


I don't see anything in rule 3 that defines "commercial vessel". Can you point me to where "commercial vessel" is defined and where it sits in pecking order? Don't see in rule 18 any mention of "commercial vessel".

Rule 3 defines "restricted in her ability to maneuver" as "a vessel which from the nature of her work is restricted in her ability to maneuver as required by these rules and is therefore unable to keep out of the way of another vessel." But, "from the nature of her work" does not mean engaged in commercial trade, it is defined later in rule 3, and no where mentions "commercial trade" or "commercial vessel".


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Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: Sloansailing] #229482
03/08/11 09:32 PM
03/08/11 09:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 271
Atlanta, Ga
BLR_0719 Offline
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BLR_0719  Offline
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Atlanta, Ga
Originally Posted by Sloansailing

I don't see anything in rule 3 that defines "commercial vessel". Can you point me to where "commercial vessel" is defined and where it sits in pecking order? Don't see in rule 18 any mention of "commercial vessel".

Rule 3 defines "restricted in her ability to maneuver" as "a vessel which from the nature of her work is restricted in her ability to maneuver as required by these rules and is therefore unable to keep out of the way of another vessel." But, "from the nature of her work" does not mean engaged in commercial trade, it is defined later in rule 3, and no where mentions "commercial trade" or "commercial vessel".


"Commercial vessel is defined by the USCG. It's not explicitly mentioned in the RRS, but many SI's specifically state that commercial vessels have right-of-way. I know this isn't a race situation, but if it were and if the SI's stated boats must give way to commercial vessels then it could be possible that a sea plane could have ROW provided it meets the criteria of a commercial vessel.








Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: BLR_0719] #229547
03/09/11 08:59 PM
03/09/11 08:59 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 35
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John_C Offline
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Posts: 35
Our sailing club has the question about taxiing seaplanes on a written test. Years ago someone that had taken the test came up to me and said that he had a seaplane license, and his job was working with FAA regulations. He said that he was going to tell us we were wrong about seaplanes not having right of way, but he decided to check first and found out he was wrong.

I think the chances that seaplane pilots don't know the rules for while they're on the water is pretty high.

He also said he got interested in sailing because he got curious as to why sailboats kept turning in random directions to get in his way.

John

Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: John_C] #229552
03/09/11 11:06 PM
03/09/11 11:06 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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South Carolina
Originally Posted by John_C
Our sailing club has the question about taxiing seaplanes on a written test. Years ago someone that had taken the test came up to me and said that he had a seaplane license, and his job was working with FAA regulations. He said that he was going to tell us we were wrong about seaplanes not having right of way, but he decided to check first and found out he was wrong.

I think the chances that seaplane pilots don't know the rules for while they're on the water is pretty high.

He also said he got interested in sailing because he got curious as to why sailboats kept turning in random directions to get in his way.

John


[slaps forehead]

Oh dear lord...


Jake Kohl
Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: BLR_0719] #229809
03/15/11 07:57 PM
03/15/11 07:57 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 172
Anacortes
Sloansailing Offline
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Sloansailing  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 172
Anacortes
Originally Posted by BLR_0719
Originally Posted by Sloansailing

I don't see anything in rule 3 that defines "commercial vessel". Can you point me to where "commercial vessel" is defined and where it sits in pecking order? Don't see in rule 18 any mention of "commercial vessel".

Rule 3 defines "restricted in her ability to maneuver" as "a vessel which from the nature of her work is restricted in her ability to maneuver as required by these rules and is therefore unable to keep out of the way of another vessel." But, "from the nature of her work" does not mean engaged in commercial trade, it is defined later in rule 3, and no where mentions "commercial trade" or "commercial vessel".


"Commercial vessel is defined by the USCG. It's not explicitly mentioned in the RRS, but many SI's specifically state that commercial vessels have right-of-way. I know this isn't a race situation, but if it were and if the SI's stated boats must give way to commercial vessels then it could be possible that a sea plane could have ROW provided it meets the criteria of a commercial vessel.


Where does the US Coast Guard define "commercial vessel" was my question... Its not in the COLREGS. I am not talking about RRS or Sailing Instructions, I am talking about the COLREGS, in which sailboats have right of way over sea planes, whether they are a "commercial vessel" or not. We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one...


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Re: Strange but real right-of-way question [Re: Sloansailing] #229838
03/16/11 01:05 PM
03/16/11 01:05 PM
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Posts: 3,969
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brucat Offline
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This may be over-simplifying this, but it doesn't really matter. As you mentioned above, there's "right" and there's "dead-right".

Stay away from seaplanes. If you crash into one (more likely, one crashes into you), it's probably going to be up to your relatives to sort out who had the right of way.

Mike

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