| Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: Timbo]
#231453 04/23/11 03:12 AM 04/23/11 03:12 AM |
Joined: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,669 Melbourne, Australia Tornado_ALIVE
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,669 Melbourne, Australia | When is the last time any of you keyboard comando's went out and sailed your punny little beach cats in 29knots? How'd that work out for you? Are you kidding!!!!! Hell, have trained in average 30 and came back without swimming and I am sure I am far from the only one here. Some people enjoy sailing in a bit of breeze. Now let’s see...... These things are designed for a limit of 33 knots. It was gusting 29, could have even been averaging in the teens. The Tornado class limit is 25 knots sustained and in those conditions, you could easily see gusts over 30 during the race. We do not all need | | | Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: catman]
#231463 04/24/11 09:58 AM 04/24/11 09:58 AM |
Joined: Nov 2002 Posts: 465 FL sail7seas
addict
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addict
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 465 FL | As you all know, this a common beachcat issue and I have capsized mucho times doing this transition there are two methods I have learned as I have never been successful just turning the corner in the high wind range unless I get lucky and turn in a lull.
One way; going around the weather mark from close hauled to downwind the cat will momentarily go on a reach, if I do not twist the main & jib a bit the cat will go over sideways. And I must make it a moderate turn, if I make a sharp turn, it just drives the lee hull down the mine. During the maneuver the jib needs to be released (blipped) for a second at the reach point of sail (to prevent a reach pitchpole) then quickly hauled back into stall the main to prevent the downwind pitchpole, then release/trim for speed the jib to powerup once the transition is completed. (CAUTION sailing stalled in winds under 25nt is SLOW)
Second way; if I know from reading the conditions and boat behavior on the upwind leg that it is really honking, and I want to survive the mark rounding, I will modify the above. A moderate turn, and at 90 to the wind, dump both main traveler and jib sheet momentarily, then once downwind quickly bring them back both in to prevent the ensuing downwind pitchpole. The wilder things are the harder the crew sheets in the jib stalling the main to prevent the downwind pitch pole. (CAUTION sailing stalled in winds under 25nt is SLOW)
Third way; yours?
Have you ever seen a plane fly backwards? Or stalled? Sailing stalled out (falling in an airplane) with managed projected area (twist or travel) is my key to reducing the excess of wind power. Every notice how slow it is when the crew over sheets the jib, he is STALLING / depowering the sails. Have you ever seen a plane fly backwards? Sailing stalled out with managed projected area is the my key to reducing the excess of wind pressure.
Catamaran mark rounding changed with the addition of spinnaker, turning around the weather mark quickly no longer became a priority in moderate winds. The priority became going hot around the mark, setting the chute, and protecting your wind, from the attacking boat behind. If you turn the mark to quickly, there is a good chance the boat behind will blanket/ pass you with a hotter/faster angle. However,pushing the envelope in the high wind range as the AC 45 did, does not make any sense to me, as you are already going very close to top speed, and already on the verge of losing it.
Observing recent x40 video the cat that went over was sailing hot around the mark had their traveler out and powered up, vs ETNZ behind had theirs only a couple feet out from center and going comparatively slow.
Perhaps just depower wing by twisting the top section independently?
These guys have proved like beachcats you can not just bear away around the mark like a keelboat, and need to read the conditions and sail accordingly, or figure out a way to stall the wing making the transition. Moderate conditions the bear away is no big deal and passing is possible, but at the top of the wind range / top speed, push the envelope to where? | | | Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: Todd_Sails]
#231487 04/25/11 12:09 PM 04/25/11 12:09 PM |
Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 976 France pepin
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 976 France | [...] I pitch poled my 18HT 2 weeks ago reaching with the kite at 19.3 kts. (Speed puck confirmed after the fact) That was fun! Flew around the boat just forward of the leeward bow. Capt'n, your story, and I'd stick to it, was that you were just checking out the jib and bridle wire while underway! Except there's no jib on a 18HT... Here goes the excuse! | | | Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: pepin]
#231515 04/26/11 12:27 AM 04/26/11 12:27 AM |
Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,584 +31NL Tony_F18
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584 +31NL | | | | Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: Tony_F18]
#231516 04/26/11 02:04 AM 04/26/11 02:04 AM |
Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,584 +31NL Tony_F18
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584 +31NL | | | | Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: Sloansailing]
#231526 04/26/11 09:50 AM 04/26/11 09:50 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 3,906 Clermont, FL, USA David Ingram
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906 Clermont, FL, USA | I agree! It's going to be a great series and I couldn't be more pleased that they will sail in some breeze!
David Ingram F18 USA 242 http://www.solarwind.solar"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda "Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall "You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
| | | Re: TNZ flipped AC-45
[Re: ThunderMuffin]
#231530 04/26/11 11:49 AM 04/26/11 11:49 AM |
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 6,049 Sebring, Florida. Timbo
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049 Sebring, Florida. | Sail-World has a nice article with pictures. Also I read somewhere that TNZ just hired Morrelli and Melvin to "...adress the volume in the bow issues..."
http://www.sail-world.com/NZ/Americas-Cup:-Oracle-Racings-James-Spithill-joins-the-Mile-High-Club/82857
Blade F16 #777
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