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Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261264
07/12/13 08:47 AM
07/12/13 08:47 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
To add to what Jake said, that was a NAF-18 policy that was suggested by IF18CA. We (the NAF-18 volunteers) tried hard to keep that policy, but as Mark alludes, it was an on-line guessing game as to who was sailing what for big events...


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261272
07/12/13 10:23 AM
07/12/13 10:23 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 554
Boston, Ma
J
Jeff.Dusek Offline
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Jeff.Dusek  Offline
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Boston, Ma
And it's all over!

1. Besson/Lagarrigue (Infusion)
2. Styles/Mason (Phantom)
3. Booth/Booth (Infusion)

Still waiting on full final results


USF18 Eastern Area Rep
Nacra Infusion USA 753
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261279
07/12/13 11:27 AM
07/12/13 11:27 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
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Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
Congrats to Taylor and Matt - Youth World Champs!


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261281
07/12/13 11:41 AM
07/12/13 11:41 AM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 932
Solomon's Island, MD
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samc99us Offline
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samc99us  Offline
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Posts: 932
Solomon's Island, MD
Congrats to Taylor and Matt, where are the provisional results?

Sounds like Mischa had some bad luck this week with the broken main halyard and the bfd. Shame but that is a ridiculously tough fleet!


Scorpion F18
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Jake] #261289
07/12/13 01:48 PM
07/12/13 01:48 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Mark Schneider Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mark Schneider  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Ah Jake.... sucks to be old and remember the ancient history that young pups have no idea about. (grin)

If you are going to drop 15K (at that time) on a boat..) you absolutely were going to find out what boat was doing well and who was paying the drivers (or not). It never made sense to me to hide the info.


crac.sailregattas.com
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261290
07/12/13 02:03 PM
07/12/13 02:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 932
Solomon's Island, MD
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samc99us Offline
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Solomon's Island, MD
Surprisingly Mark I'm not that young...I remember every F18 Nationals result NOT having boat names, Hobie winning a lot because they had paid drivers and a faster design. Didn't concern me at the time since I didn't have $15K for a brand new Tiger...which today looks like a bargain. Cost is definitely exceeding inflation.


Scorpion F18
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261311
07/13/13 09:06 AM
07/13/13 09:06 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
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From the three Worlds I have been to this was probably the best one, certainly from a sailing point of view.
Most days we would start around 1pm in light air which would then build to about 15+ kts.

There was quite a lot of damage though, one Infusion hull was so badly damaged that the local fibreglass gurus didn't even bother.
The rest where mostly various nose jobs, daggerboard cases etc.
I think this location will be a hard one to match.

IMHO all the designs are quite equal overall and I don't think one specific design stands out performance wise.

Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Tony_F18] #261312
07/13/13 10:12 AM
07/13/13 10:12 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Mark Schneider Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mark Schneider  Offline
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Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Very cool

So, the F18 sailors are focused on Racing.... The class rules look like they stable and people behaved themselves within the rules.

Is there any buzz among the sailors that the next thing for them personally is a flying foiled catamran.... (the need for speed thing.... the next challenge... or a 5 year itch disease)

Or is the boat entertaining enough and what you really want is numbers on the line and good competition.

Last edited by Mark Schneider; 07/13/13 10:14 AM.

crac.sailregattas.com
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261313
07/13/13 11:56 AM
07/13/13 11:56 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
This topic, Mark, is discussed at length every time non-F18 sailors get together. For the F18 people, it is a pretty short conversation - flying F18s are cool, but not a threat to the class. Toying with a foiling F18 is fun, but why try with a 400-pound boat?

F18 is healthy and sustainable with good competition among builders and sailors.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261318
07/13/13 06:15 PM
07/13/13 06:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,969
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brucat Offline
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Well said John. If I was in the market for something other than a Wave or Hobie 16 (I have very young kids I want to race with), the F18 would definitely be my choice.

Mike

Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261477
07/18/13 02:10 AM
07/18/13 02:10 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Does anyone have experience sailing at the 2014 venue, Bangor-Nothern Ireland?

I have been watching windguru and so far this month winds have been pretty terrible:
[Linked Image]

Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: coralreefer] #261527
07/21/13 02:38 PM
07/21/13 02:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 246
Kiel, Germany
Baltic Offline
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Baltic  Offline
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Posts: 246
Kiel, Germany
Originally Posted by coralreefer
Speaking of boats and rooting for the USA, is boat GER292 sailing a Falcon F18?

If so, i'm rooting for them to have a good result as well, as their on a "Made in the USA" boat.



Yes, it's Arne Gosche and Michael Walther from Kiel, Germany. I've heard that they hit a floating object with major damage to the boat - thus the unsatisfying result.


F18: C2 / A-Cat: Minelli
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Tony_F18] #261530
07/21/13 03:23 PM
07/21/13 03:23 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 912
Dublin, Ireland
Dermot Offline
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Dermot  Offline
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Posts: 912
Dublin, Ireland
Originally Posted by Tony_F18
Does anyone have experience sailing at the 2014 venue, Bangor-Nothern Ireland?

I have been watching windguru and so far this month winds have been pretty terrible:
[Linked Image]

I have sailed cats at Ballyholme many times in the past 20 years, usually good winds - great "Craic". Ireland has had a very uncharacteristic heatwave for the past month, with high pressure and light winds. Irish Sailing Clubs have very good reputation for organising memorable sailing events - on and off the course.


Dermot
Catapult 265
www.catamaran.ie
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261556
07/22/13 10:22 AM
07/22/13 10:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
R
Reiss Offline OP
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Reiss  Offline OP
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USA Teams, lets start organizing a container for Ireland! Get with Taylor Reiss or Matthew Whitehead if you have any interest in going. If we can get a full container, the cost would be reasonable for all. Here is hoping for a good turn out of USA teams for 2014!

Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261557
07/22/13 10:30 AM
07/22/13 10:30 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 554
Boston, Ma
J
Jeff.Dusek Offline
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Boston, Ma
The only problem with a container is that the Worlds are July 5-11, meaning we lose our boats for almost the entire summer season. It's a hard sell.


USF18 Eastern Area Rep
Nacra Infusion USA 753
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261558
07/22/13 10:45 AM
07/22/13 10:45 AM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 932
Solomon's Island, MD
S
samc99us Offline
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Solomon's Island, MD
PM sent Reiss.

Jeff, I understand the excuse but it's a poor one. The real question is when do the boats get back from Ireland? If they return mid-August that works fine for me. July and August are notoriously hot, humid and lacking breeze in Annapolis. Ireland sounds much more pleasant.

We have good sailing April through early June and then September-November. So we would loose a month of training on the F18, which sucks but most everyone else is in that same situation. The question for us is do we do Catacup again if we're invited back or do we go to Ireland? First world problems...


Last edited by samc99us; 07/22/13 10:52 AM.

Scorpion F18
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261562
07/22/13 11:09 AM
07/22/13 11:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 186
wildtsail7 Offline
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wildtsail7  Offline
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Posts: 186
Minimally it would be 2 weeks on each end but I could easily see it Week to two for freight, roughly a week for clearing customs. We should probably give it 3 weeks on the lead end. That means we would miss three regattas including Hyannis. Yes Annapolis sucks but that is a month to a month and a half during our 5 month sailing season. And June and July are some of our prime sailing. I know by June I'm itching to do some warm sailing since May can be hit or miss.
Plus loading and unloading a container is at least one day off work each time, quite a bit of physical work, and a pain in the butt.
Rough guess is a container would be 6-9K each way? (f we get 5 teams that's still $2,400 a team right? Unless my guessing is totally off. I don't know if anyone has priced it out latley but last September to ship a container from CA to FL was around 8K but that was via truck which is quite a bit more expensive than sea freight.
I think what I'm getting at is I'd much rather charter but of course they have to be available!

Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: wildtsail7] #261563
07/22/13 11:22 AM
07/22/13 11:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Naples, FL
Originally Posted by wildtsail7

I think what I'm getting at is I'd much rather charter but of course they have to be available!


With what you say, a charter makes perfect sense for those who don't want to "lose" their boats for the season. Do dealers have the ability to carry 4-5 boats each model year for charters in their region?

I would suspect dealers can't tie up that kind of capital, but I guess they could get residual value upon selling when they buy the new model year. And charter parties would know they're getting excellent boats rigged up right....? Might solve some of the insurance issues as well...

5 boats @ $20k USD/boat = $100k

5 charters per year x 5 boats x $2500 per charter = $62,500 annual

Maintenance, delivery & Expense ($3,000) x 5 boats = $15,000

Residual value ($12,500) x 5 boats = $62,500

So:

Revenue - expenses =

(Charter revenue + Residual value) - (Purchase + Maintenance)

($62,500 + $62,500) - ($100,000 + $15,000) = $10,000 net


I guess the next questions are:
- are there 5 "charter-worthy" events in that region
- is $2,500 USD a reasonable price-point for a charter (new, race-ready, delivered to the regatta site)

It all looks so easy on the inner-net...


Jay

Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: samc99us] #261564
07/22/13 11:35 AM
07/22/13 11:35 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 554
Boston, Ma
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Jeff.Dusek Offline
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Jeff.Dusek  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 554
Boston, Ma
Originally Posted by samc99us
PM sent Reiss.

Jeff, I understand the excuse but it's a poor one. The real question is when do the boats get back from Ireland? If they return mid-August that works fine for me. July and August are notoriously hot, humid and lacking breeze in Annapolis. Ireland sounds much more pleasant.

We have good sailing April through early June and then September-November. So we would loose a month of training on the F18, which sucks but most everyone else is in that same situation. The question for us is do we do Catacup again if we're invited back or do we go to Ireland? First world problems...



I guess a lot depends where you are in the country. Assuming three weeks on either side of the event, that is most of June, all of July, and maybe part of August. That is the primary season for New England.

Now I am not completely opposed to the idea, especially after the amount of time I put in trying to find a charter for Italy. I certainly consider myself in the interested category, but to lose so much sailing the price needs to be right.


USF18 Eastern Area Rep
Nacra Infusion USA 753
Re: 2013 F18 Worlds [Re: Reiss] #261565
07/22/13 11:43 AM
07/22/13 11:43 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Tony_F18  Offline
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FYI: Round Texel 2014 is just one week before the Worlds smile

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