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you mention that the Dragoon may have a role to play, but it's not clear to me how it fits into your thinking about the F12.



It doesn't. F12 is oriented significantly differently then the Dragoon. The F12 is far more the equivalent of the laser-1, topper and splash while the dragoon is really much more the equivalent of the 29-er and 420.

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I don't know the boat at all but it's close to 12' so I'm just curious about why it wouldn't meet the requirements you have in mind for the entry class.


Basically the Dragoon is a scaled down F18 to kids format, it comes with nearly all the drawbacks of such an involved boat. It is by no means as accessible as the optimist or laser dinghies (and spin-offs like the topper and splash). It is a full-on double hander with a spinnaker and requires dedicated crews that suit the boat.

I feel that no kids goes straight into the 29-er class, they start out sailing on easier and less complex boats. Only when the kid has proven his determination then the parents will consider a more expensive and involved boat. For these reasons I don't really consider the Dragoon as an entry boat for young sailors. I fear that for the above reasons kids will still start out in opties and splashes and laser and then be "brainwashed" into disliking cats and prefering 29-ers and 49-ers, because that is the way things are in mono world.

I actually like the Dragoon but it is a bit of neither. It is not entry enough and you grow out of it too soon. Also I'm sorry to say that it is made by Hobie. They have a talent for not picking the right colours and styling. I'm also not too sure if alot of crews are actually sailing that boat now, it doesn't seem to be really popular and its international presence is negligiable outside of France and the directly surrounding European states. As such is it much less well positioned then say the Nacra 5.0 and 500's.

In its race version it is not cheap. 2004 price was 7500 Euro's. That is cheaper then the 29-er. But no were near as inexpensive as the splash (3800 Euro). The splash is an smaller, more modern and lighter version of the laser. It features a more modern rig (more rectangular) and it is designed specifically for 12-16 year olds.

http://www.splash-boat.com/en/sales_info/dealers.htm

Again no kid at 12 gets into 29-ers straight away, they pass through the entry class like the splash first which feed into the 29er.

Another thing to consider is that the Splash organisation (and it is an large and ISAF recognized class) offers boats to active 12 years old sailors, for almost no fee at all. They can probably do that because the boats are so inexpensive and hardly anything can break because there aren't sensitive items like spinnakers on them. We can never do that with Dragoon as they are too expensive and use to much components like ratchet blocks and spinnakers. But the F12 is suited to such setups. Also the splash weights 75 kg (hull = 52 kg) and the mast is collapsable, that means it is truly car toppable and easily stored. The Dragoon isn't.

Maybe the F12 can be the feeder into the dragoon.

I still wrote that it may have a role to play.


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Secondly why do you think it is that the Nacra 500 is doing better than the SL16?


Basically the Nacra 500 is faster, cheaper and has a much higher international presence, mostly because of its very similar predessor Nacra 5.0. In ALL other aspects the two boats are the same. Why go through the trouble of establishing a whole new class when you have such an alternative.

I haven't seen the Sl16's myself but comments by others seem to suggest that the finishing is not its strongest point. I have seen the Nacra 500's (there are already 5 of them at my club alone) and the finishing of those is top notch.

Forgive me for saying so but SL16 appears to be French and certainly Dutch sailors are not attracted to it. I now the Spanish are not embracing it and statements from F16 sailors in Asia suggest it is not accepted there. And we can continue this list with Australia, USA and the like while the Nacra 5.0 and 500 are getting interest its seems. At my club the nacra 500's are quickly gethering. The buyers prefer these.

Maybe also because the SL16 is advertised to much as a youth boat. In the end its is daddy who buys the boat because he wants to sail as well. The SL16 concept is just not right in this respect.

There can well be other reason I not know about, I'm sure there are, but SL16 is not happening from what I can tell.


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Also you say the 500 will replace the SL16, but is that feasible if the ISAF don't change their stance?


I regret saying it but I think that I'm convinced that it is better to ignore ISAF as much as you can. They don't drive stuff or start new things, the are followers. If some group of enthousiasts make a particular class into a succes then they are right on top of it to make it ISAF recognized, but they won't do much on their own initiative. It has all the outward signs of a clocked up bureaucracy. Not a good place to start new initiatives or change the status-quo. Look at how the youth calender is setup now ; 2008 = youth worlds on SL16 but in 2009 it is on Hobie 16's again ! What a BS is that ? No-one is going to buy the SL16 at 14.000 for one year. This way the association with ISAF and its machination is rather the kiss of death.

In line with this reasonign I don't think it make much difference at all what ISAF prefers. The won't make it happen themselves, they won't help out in a meaningful way and they just wait for other people to do the work for them. If the Nacra 500 is better at that then they will just switch over in say 5 to 10 years time.

Wouter

Last edited by Wouter; 10/02/07 08:41 AM.