Kaos
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Here is my problem from race results. A) I have rarely raced in a sailboat race where the wind was consistent. Either direction or speed always changed. All of the rating systems make that a central assumption. This makes rating boat accurately almost impossible.


Sorry, Your conclusion is wrong.
Most classes are more or less linear as the wind speed picks up. a Single number is fine... The subset of catamarans are more non linear then displacement monos. Foilers are extremely non linear.
Handicaping is possible although the Precision of handicap racing is NOT close to One design Racing in determining the best sailed boat...

The solution to handicapping increasing non linear performance is to use ratings based on the wind.... However... this adds complexity to running a race and both sailors and race committees have proven over the years to just not like using multiple handicap numbers. Point is... a solution is EASILY available in either measurement or Portsmouth type handicaping systems..

The ACCURACY of a ratings table is arguable... See my point to Mike... It is a freakin UNICORN.... See Jake's example... and the debate in the bar will close it down... AND it will be debatable forever...

So... now you need a consensus and a governing authority to end the debate.

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In a fleet of 10 one design boats there can be a 30 minute difference between the first boat and the last boat. Is the first boat get used for the "correct" rating?


In portsmouth... YES this is the ONLY data point used in updating the tables (IF other conditions are met as well).

The Ginormous point is.... the 9 other boats ARE sailing to a rating.... Most of the time, even the second place boat is NOT even close to sailing to their published rating.... So you are really hairsplitting when you compare Portsmouth to SCHRS.... Why is this so... Because its the nature of sailboat racing... clear air is KING! Starboard trumps PORT... so you can add 10 seconds for the tack. and so on..

Bottom line... handicap will not have the precision of one design racing. Accuracy is a unicorn.... So, We agree on a mechanism to handicap and have the system sanctioned. They win... you are second, I am third. Enjoy life!

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Is the first boat get used for the "correct" rating? Now we have one Hobie 16 racing some other boats and he gets his data uses as if he was first. Was the sailor of that H16 of the same level as the sailor of the 1st one design sailor or the last? This is how results get loaded and it leads to a lot of variance and then we are into the land of false belief.


You have identified the achilles heel of PORTSMOUTH handicaping. The foundational assumption is that the Hobie 16 first boat is as well sailed as the F18 first place boat. Large numbers of races between these two classes take care of this sailor difference... I defy you to list 100 races conducted anywhere in the country for a W/L race between a Hobie 16 and a F18.... much less finding 100 races between two evenly matched helms or as the system was designed TWO FLEETS Hobie 16s and F18s racing each other for 100 races (You don't want a Randy Smythe personal handicap rating...) This is why Portsmouth has become Portsmouth/PHRF.

There is NO TRANSPARENCY in the PN tables constructed from this years data given the facts on the water in North American Sail boat racing..

MEASUREMENT systems.. (SCHRS or TExel or HPR or IRC for big boats) Don't have this issue.... they create the formula, PUBLISH the formula, apply it to a class's measurements and then see how the rating matches actual performance results.... looking at the entire FLEET of designs..... (eg... we look at pin head mains... on Hobie 16s and Prindle 16s and compare the PIN head factor to boats that use square tops... and so on..) You adjust the factors to fit valid data sets.... and work the problem year after year.

When you get tired of racing in two boat one design fleets... Handicap racing is an alternative. (you probably can count and figure out your one design result) I make the case that SCHRS is a Fair and transparent system....

Form a consensus around one table or the other and ask for official sanction.... OA's will happily do what an organized body of sailors asks for... (they don't care... they want the max fun factor for their event) They can't listen to whinny bitches moaning abut the XXX rating....


Last edited by Mark Schneider; 05/06/15 02:47 PM.

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