<**** comments here around, about cfrp (carbon) as the wonder weapon to save weight. There are many other possibilities to reduce weight without impact on structural integrity. In my business with save around 10% weight per 20 years (not only better materials, but also better engineering, processes, etc.) and I think there are similar figures for other industries. Small boat industry resists this trend. I wonder why a Torando could weight 160kg in timber and alu 30 years ago, and why a F16 now should weight 140kg, which is shorter, less wide, has less sail area and is build for lower crew weight. In my opinion, that is because most classes are either OD, or Formula with is very friendly to the manufacturer (yet that are/can be quite nice boats). The formula 16 is a bit different, because it is more customer friendly (less weight) and this might be the reason, why there is this constant attacking by manufacturer (well by some persons who are paid by...)
Cheers,
Klaus
Klaus,
The Tornado is a good measure because the quality of the sailors is of a high and consistent standard, there were regattas held as the carbon mast was introduced where there was a mix in alloy and carbon rigs competing and the carbon masts were faster even at the early stages of sail development for the new masts.
If you look at the surface area on a Tornado hull you will find that its less than a current generation F18 and not so much bigger than a Viper, simply put: the newer hull shapes are bigger. The weight difference between a Tornado and a Viper is around 40kg which is quite a difference when you consider that the hull area is quite close and the F16 Mast area is close to the Tornado, beams are same section just shorter.. not too many areas to get rid of 40kg are there??
And I just want to clear something up here: I am not being paid by any manufacturer. Currently I have no contracts with any catamaran manufacturer.
You missed my point. I didn't say the CFRP mast on T's isn't better. It is just the question by how much. Now translate this difference from professional sailors, which as you say are close in performance and put in down on week end club level sailing. There will be no difference, as can also read in the results of F16 races: A Stealth f16 is no guarantee to victory.
The mast of a T is 1m taller, each beam is 0.5m longer, I am too lazy to calc the complete sail area, but is significant larger and as consequence the forces are larger, the torque loads are way higher. Since the lower loads on a F16, much lighter crosssection for the beams could be used, but also other load carrying parts can be lighter. I haven't calculate, but I would estimate a F16, if sized with the same criteria to be around 100kg-110kg (I was thinking of home building one some time ago). And this is just based on a T, designed in timber and alu, back in 1970 or so... So no need to argue the min weight would be unrealistic. If a manufacturer decide to use parts from the F18 production and design the hulls for carring two full size adults, it will be heavier, not necessarily slower. It's a design choice.
Some manufacturers will not achieve it, or they have boats in the same market segment. Maybe some of them or some of their dealers have you paid in the past or will you pay in future.
But the big point finally is, that the class member are happy with their rules, the boats and the boat builder involved. So why change something?
